Customs fine $5000

[hitek]

Earlier in this thread I did some babbling and last week refused some loads going up to Canada. To be a successful in this business, as pointed out by some of you going up there is pretty much mandatory. I will be training a co-driver here in the next week or so and the longer the runs the better. Who knows, we could get a load from up there going to Texas. Have only been at this for 3 months now, and havent gone up there yet. I think the best thing might be to ask dispatch for a load going up and just do it, just get it over with. If you guys all do it, it cant be that complicated.

 

[ATeam]

>A-Team...JuJu and I have never been told of this visibility
>rule. Maybe cuz they can't see down in a van? JuJu and I
>have been asked to get out of vehicle so they can see the
>passenger though. We were also told that TWO names must be
>on the inbound manifest and both dribvers must be at the
>customs counter when presenting paperwork inside.

Our education came when Diane drove to a quiet border crossing from Canada to U.S ( I foreget which one). There was no line and no one in the guard shack. I was asleep in the back. Diane went inside with both our pasports and ID's. That's when she was told that all vehicle occupants must present themselves visible to the officers. The fine for not doing so - according to this officer - was something like $5,000 or $10,000. Needless to say, we're both visible when crossing the border now.

 

[ATeam]

>Prof: The $5 is a user fee that the Customs charges all
>USofA citizens who use the service. It's much like
>admission to a National park is only charged to thos who use
>that service. Persons who cross into the U.S. frequently
>can purchase a windshield decal for $100 per annum.

Dont you just love how our government charges us a fee to return to our own country?

 

[terryandrene]

>Dont you just love how our government charges us a fee to
>return to our own country?

I, for one, do love it.

User fees are much more preferable to me than for all government services be free to the user but the cost to provide those services be shared equally by all the citizens.

 

[Trucker don]

I'm a Canadian Trucker from out of Ontario. My company although alittle slow on the PAPS. I mention Paps to them 5 years ago. It wasn't unitl they were force into getting them. We now have them.
However. If you have your FAST Card. (ALL PASSENGERS must FAST CARD as well) You can Use the Barcode, (Line Release). However this is from our company. IF NO Fast, but you have an (FAST) application in. PAPS must be used, if there is a line release (BRASS).You wipe out the BARCODE and fax PAPS to Custom broker. Must have Filer Code for Broker.
DO not attempt to cross until you know the Broker has inputted your load info into the computer. They may say it's in, give another hour. I did a load out of Toronto. The Broker Norm Jensen said it was in the computer. However when I got to the Primary Booth. The Custome agent said it was not on file. Luckily, I had a cover sheet and the paper from the fax saying it was Faxed. I get to Norm, He said it's in the computer, USA Custom that are behind.

>Hi everybody. I run for an expedite co. out of Ontario. It
>seems a lot of Canadian co. are more informed than our
>American friends.Our co. has been working on getting
>everything for FAST Approval for well over a year. They have
>kept us well informed with news letters and driver meetings
>so we wouldn't be caught with our pants down.If you checked
>the Canadian site re ''PAPS''Redbeard 2001 spelled it all
>out for you and even gave a ''web site to go to''.These
>fines are not just for you your co. gets a fine to of
>$5000.IT is just not up to us drivers to be informed but for
>our co. to inform us and give us all the tools to do the
>job.This means you should have enough PAPS & PARS stickers
>a list of phone & fax numbers for all customs brokers on
>both sides of the Border.Rember to use a PAPS you need to
>have a FAST card as well.You should get a copy showing that
>you faxed your paperwork this way you will not be fined.I
>hope this helps everybody. GOODLUCK AND BE SAFE.HAPPY NEW
>YEAR.:+ :+

 

[Trucker don]

It's not the Canadain Customs. It's the USA Customs. They have making noises about this for quite a while. If any one is to blame. It's the Carrier not notifying the Operator of any changes.
I find that a lot of USA Drivers have no idea., how to cross the border. Photocopy of A8A,s Inward cargo manifest help. Actually going across into Canada is easier. If you have the customs invoice, and A8A and say. This is my first time. Where do I go. Canada Customs Agents will be most helpful.


>lets all take a stand!!!! everyone turn down canada loads
>and let the feright sit at there loading docks with no
>trucks to move it after a while they will see giving us
>fines that big for little things will only make us not run
>feright into canada. FORD,GM,and other big companys will see
>this and lobby for changes. In other words
>STRIKE-STRIKE-STRIKE CANADA. they would have to pay me 3.00
>per mile before i ever take a load up there. in other words
>F-CANADA

 

[Trucker don]

All Commercial Vehicle must pay 5.00 to enter USA. However a little sticker can be had from Border people. 100.00 a year. Sure beats paying 5.00 to get back into your own country.

>I understand why driver and co-driver would want to be
>present, as well as having passports. What is the fiver
>for? Is is common practice to bribe the cops? :+ :+

 

[mcbride]

Oh Canada...oh Canada...how the mere mention of going there frightens the hell out of so many. LOL
I mean no disrespect to anyone and don’t want to make any waves here...however I just feel compelled to throw in my 2 cents worth.

Let me preface this post by saying: I lived next the Ontario - New York border for almost all my life and going to Canada was never a big deal. Our son and is wife live in northern Vermont so we routinely went to Montreal, PQ. We have never turned down a load going to Canada just because it was going to Canada. Frankly, I think we have even been used by FedexCC and Con-Way...you know offer McBride’s the load they will go to Canada...LOL. As a matter of fact, I can remember being with Roberts/FedexCC and having more Canadian loads than US loads some months.

My 2 cents: Most companies don’t take the time to fully train drivers on how to go to cross the border or go into Canada during orientation. (AND there are many ways that freight can be brokered to cross!) Some of you may disagree but I have been through 2 orientations with two of the larger expediting companies and Canada is just glossed over. I personally know of teams that have left Con-Way and FedexCC for companies that don’t require you carry to, from, or through Canada, just because they had encountered problems with border crossings. Now some of you may think how silly this is etc. BUT these people became actually terrified even thinking about crossing the border! Why? Because when they called their carrier/company they were given the incorrect instructions on what paperwork to use, wrong broker info, or they were routed through the incorrect crossing site! Now, these people can’t even count on their companies to help them out. So, they leave or many don’t take Canadian freight. This whole new process sounds easy enough...fax in and you’re home free...I don’t believe it for a minute. We have used Paps/Pars way before this new rule and this procedure is not always smooth sailing. The Paps/Pars works great until your paper work doesn’t make it to the booth or God forbid there is an error on your Canadian Customs Invoice and the broker can’t clear the freight. Then what? Who notifies you of this? Who can help you? NO ONE. You have the freight on your vehicle and you are stuck there until it gets straightened out. Prior to this new rule all it cost was your time and a little aggravation.

Second, most companies don’t keep you updated on border changes. As an example, we just got a fleet message today indicating the Pars/Paps was mandatory now. How long has this been in effect? What would I have done had we taken a load out of Canada yesterday and not known? I know I would have been looking at a $5,000 civil fine too.

Third, ALL companies no matter how big or small should have a person or persons on duty 24/7 that driver’s can contact that know all there is to know about Canada and Hazmat. Period.

Fourth, as far as paying the $5.00 to cross back into the states, I have no problem with it and would even pay $10.00 if I thought it would improve the attitude of the U.S. border patrol personnel. If we were going to have problems I always wished it was on the Canadian side....they used to at least try and help you out. Now they are going to be just as cranky as the US side...the co$t of going to Canada is now too steep for me.




mcbride-
--What goes around comes around--

 

[Stranded]

I have not gone to canada yet but I can say this much. My company had better inform me of EVERTHING I need to do and have before I go. $5000 might just as well be a million bucks to me and I could not imagin getting a fine in the mail like that.

5000 thanks for posting this.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

I know you people like me have been at a broker and a driver will show up with nothing but a B.O.L. !! When told to make out an inbound manifest It's like A WHAT!....How can companies treat(even a FedexCC driver once but he was from the south a 1st timer) these poor guys like this is beyond me. Also sooo many when asked don't have a clue as to what they are carrying.

A-Team..The explaination I got was...JuJu is a Co-driver hence she too is the master in charge and to be listed on the manifest. As was said many a time we are at the mercy of The Rule of The Day!

 

[Stranded]

For my benefit as well as those who are still confused, can someone who knows please reply as I attempt to play out a real life example? I plan to print the replies and use them as a check list for when I go across the border........Maybe instead of replying to these questions, it would be better to give a step by step example of all the necessary steps?

I get dispatched on a run picking up GM auto parts in Detroit delivering in Toronto.

I go to the shipper, get loaded and get the BOL and a PARS form.
Do I get the PARS form from the shipper?
Do I fill out the PARS form before I leave and then fax it?
Does my company fill it out and fax it, does the shipper fill it out and fax it or does it matter who does it - just as long as a completed form gets faxed to the broker?
Do I need special permits for my truck in order to enter Canada?
How long do I need to wait before I get to the border?
Can I call the broker prior to my arriving at the border to be sure everything is ok to cross into canada or should my company call the broker?
What other forms do I need?
What else do I need to do?
What else does my company need to do?
What else is there that I am missing?
When does FAST card come into play?

I made it into Canada and now I deliver the load.
Do I need to keep a copy of my PARS to re-enter the U.S.?
Does my PARS need to be signed by consignee?



Now I get dispatched to pick up Chrysler auto parts from a shipper in Toronto to deliver in Detroit.

I get loaded and get the BOL and a PAPS form.
Does the PAPS form need to be filled out and faxed to the broker?
How long do I need to wait before arriving at customs again?
Is a FAST card a necessity or is it only a good thing to have?
What about bar codes - when do I need them?
Where do I get a bar code?
What else do I need to do in order to re-enter the U.S.?

Now I got dispatched to pick up in Detroit to deliver in NY - I just need to take a short cut through Canada.

How does this one work?

 

[trump]

Stranded very good post. I dont have all the answers so I will let others answer your questions. Every time my dispatcher sent me to Canada I left from our dock and they handed me all my paperwork. So I need to know all about the procedure also.

 

[Finn777]

Well folks have enjoyed the comments on this subject. The latest is I wrote a letter to the commisioner of customs begging for mercy. We will see what happens. There are other drivers in the same boat also from my company. A few points I would like to make. The customs officials informed me that carriers were informed of this and had an obligation to inform their drivers not no word of mouth on the internet or truck mags etc. We cannot know everything and every law if we did we would not be drivers. There are laws out there we will never know about in our lifetime. For instance in the state of Conneticut you are required by law if you have a sleeper to have white sheets in your bunk in case of an accident, they can be used for bandages. $400 fine for that one. how many of you knew that? Or if you get stopped for speeding in a construction zone in Pa you get double the fine but also lose your CDL for a mandatory 15 days? I am sure you folks have a ton of little used laws too. We only learn by way of mouth or truck mags or sites like this how else will we know if nobody informs us? Anyhow that $5 fee we pay goes where? how is it spent and on what? that's a lot of money a year for the amount of trucks that cross. Why is it that when you cross the border in a car with your family the agents are nice and say "Welcome Home" but when we are in a truck/van their attitude changes. One tidbit of info I did find out was that all fax machines at customs brokers at the border are tied into the customs office so if a broker says they did not recieve a fax the agents can check the fax logs and if they find the broker did recieve but did not act they will fine them $5000 (get your checkbook out livingston). So in leiu of the fine the options are 1.Spend a week filling potholes on the Ambassador Bridge. 2.Go to the Norfolk Shipyard and count ship rivets for a week or 3.Spend a week at the ranch in crawford cutting brush. (there is a good deal in the Hampton Inn in Waco so we are leaning toward this option right now)any advice on which way I should go? OK folks thanks for the comments keep the info coming.

 

[RobA]

First of all: this has NOTHING WHATSOEVER with GOING to Canada. It's going into the USA.
I can't comment on the entry to the USA; not my field.
I can suggest though that all drivers should bookmark the Canada Customs website.
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/general/publications/custom-reg-e.html
There are email addresses and phone numbers where you can contact Canadian officials for answers.

On the issue of drivers being visable;
I was just reading through the Customs Self Assessment portion and found that both drivers must be CDRP approved to use the system. If one isn't you must revert to the PARS system.

There are many regulations and they are being updated all the time.
Since it is the driver who ends up paying the cost of non-compliance; you should read the regulations frequently.
That's the best way; be informed.
It is public information.

 

[BULLRUSH]

i'll take loads to canada but i won't bring freight into the us untill i'm know whats going on for sure.LANDSTAR HAS THIS ALL OVER THERE WEBSITE EXPLAINING JUST WHAT EVERBODY IS SAYING HERE. BUT NO EYE TO EYE COMMUNCATION TO ME DIRECT FROM LANDSTAR.it sound like they can do what they want now at the border it could be their word against yours no matter what you show them.

 

[BULLRUSH]

10-4 on that thats not liberty for sure

 

[truckerbuddy]

lets just stop taking loads into canada and see how they like it maybe they will pay much more money to us if they cant find anyone to take the loads.All I know is that I will never take another load into canada

 

[Lawrence]

Truckerbuddy,

This has NOTHING to do with taking loads into Canada. It is taking loads into the USA. It is the USA that is sending the fines - not Canada.

Lawrence,
Expediters Online.com


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[Doggie Daddy]

THE SKY IS FALLING,THE SKY IS FALLING!!.the hysteria is starting,it smells like money to me.DD.

 

[BULLRUSH]

i have to disagree part of your statement.WHEN GETTING a CDL IT DOESN'T TELL YOU ABOUT PROCEDURE ABOUT RULES RELATING TO CANADA.IT TELL YOU ABOUT FINES ELSE WHERE BUT NOT CANADA.IF LAWS CHANGE IT'S UP TO THE GOV- TO ADVISE THE CARRIERS OR INDIVUAL OWNER OPERATORS OF LAW CHANGES.I GO TO CANADA ALL THE TIME AND KNEW NOTHING OF THE CHANGES UNTIL LAST WEEK WHEN LANDSTAR POSTED IT ON THEIR WEBSITE AND TO SAY IT'S NOT THE CARRIER RESPONCIBILTY IS WRONG.IF NOTHING ELSE YOU SHOULD BE WARNED ONCE BEFORE A FINED IS WRITTEN.WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A 5000 DOLLAR FINE.WHAT HAPPENS IF A PROCEDURE CHANGES TODAY WITHOUT WARNNING AND YOU ARE FINED FOR SOMETHING THAT YOU OR YOUR CARRIER KNEW NOTHING ABOUT I WOULD BE PISSED .I JUST THINK IT'S SNEAKY THAT ALL.PS MAYBEY IF EVERYBODY THAT WAS CLUESLESS INCLUDING MYSELF WOULD OF BEEN ON-LINE ALITTLE MORE THE LAST FEW MONTHS I KNOW WE WOULD OF BEEN INFORMED ABOUT THE CHANGES.IT'S BAD WHEN A ON-LINE TUCKING WEBSITE INFORMES YOU OF RULE CHANGES AND FINES BUT THE GOV&CARRIERS WON'T.IT IS OUR RESPONCIBILLTY TO MAKE CHANGES IN OUR PROCEDURES ONCE WE KNOW ABOUT THEM.