Class C CDL and Info

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

HI,

I am currently talking with a gentleman about driving his cargo van that is leased on to Panther II. I have a couple of questions and thought you may be able to give me some good honest answers.

1. 1st in the lease agreement, I am responsible for truck insurance on a new Ford E350 with a diesel engine. How much should I plan on spending on this on a weekly basis and where do I get it. I checked with my insurance carrier on my personal vehicles and they said they could not do it since I do not own the vehicle.

2. Panther II requires a CDL with HazMat Endorsement. I checked with the state I live in and was told that I need a class C CDL. Can anyone tell me what kind of driving test is required and how do you do the pre trip inspection on a cargo van. Also I will not have the van until after I get my CDL - Can I take it in my personnal vehicle?

I would appreciate anyone's help and input. Thanks and have a grwat day!

terryandrene · Feb 13, 2005

JKN: Here's the link to your state's DMV:

http://www.dps.state.al.us/public/driverlicense/faq.asp#anchor851895

You should be able to get all the info peculiar to your stste there.

I don't believe any insurance carrier will let you insure another's vehicle. Typically, a driver leased to an owner who is leased to a carrier(i.e.PantherII) pays only fuel and tolls, if anthing at all. The owner can usually get coverage thru a group plan the carrier employs. If agreeable to you, you might pay the owner, out of your settlement, for his coverage but that would normally be unusual.

People who already have a drivers license may not be required to take a road test in a cargo van. You should be able to get the requirement for a pretrip inspection in the state study guide for commercial vehicles. The pretrip is pretty simple and only those parts that apply to a van would be required. The inspector may just quiz you on the insp, but you should be prepared to actually do it. You can have the check-off sheet in hand and use it to perform the inspection.

If you need a van for the test, consider either buying lunch for a friend with a van to use his or rent a ryder for a few dollars.

Terry

Crazynuff · Feb 13, 2005

I'd look elsewhere for a job that doesn't require hazmat or paying for the insurance . Buying your own van and leasing directly to a non-hazmat carrier makes more sense . The background check for hazmat will delay your getting started by at least 30 days . Check for god , used . low mileage vans to start . If things work out you can trade up to new .

Tom Robertson · Feb 13, 2005

1st in the lease agreement, I am responsible for truck
insurance on a new Ford E350 with a diesel engine.

knelson....

The owner you are speaking with is either a newbie in this industry, is taking advantage of his drivers, or has an very unusual arrangement with the working half of his business.

A typical arrangement would have you the driver responsible for fuel and tolls only with a percentage of the revenue to the van. The starting revenue will vary from owner to owner and is partially dependent on which carrier the owner has the lease.

I have not heard of an arrangement where the owner requires the insurance to be paid by the driver, and as pointed out by previous responders, the only way I am aware that this could be acccomplished is for you to re-imburse the owner for these charges.

If you have no experience in expediting, my advice is to look for another owner. If you are experienced in expediting, you might consider purchasing your own van. If not... there are many owners that have been in the business for some time and have several vehicles placed with various carriers. Their experience will make for a much better arrangement for you.

davekc · Feb 13, 2005

I agree with the above. Why would you pay for the insurance on someone elses vehicle? I wouldn't pay the QC charge either if that is mentioned. Only your personal insurance should be considered. It would appear that he/she is a rip off artist if they insist on these terms.
In addition, make sure you are not paying for maintenence and repairs.
There are many other owners within Panther that can give you a better package.
Davekc
owner
20 years

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

Thank you for your info. I will be sure to check out the link and will talk to the folks at the DPS to find out exactly what I need to do. Thanks for your time and input!

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

I appreciate everone's input. It seems that maybe this is not the best situation for a newbie to get into. As the old saying goes "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is"! The lease reads as follows:

Lessee (Driver) will pay truck insurance, fuel, fuel taxes, tolls, qualcom, and occupational health insurance. Lessors (Owner) will pay truck maintenence and all licenses.

So I assume from what you all have been saying that this is not the best deal out there. Also what is occupational health insurance? Is it available from the company and what should I expect to pay for it? Thanks again for everones help and input.

terryandrene · Feb 13, 2005

JKN: Your reply prompts the questions: What type of arrangement would you have with the owner? Would you be leasing the truck with an option to buy? What percentage of the gross revenue to the truck would you get, or would you get a per-mile price? All miles or just the loaded miles. What carrier is the truck leased to?

On the surface, you should run from this deal; however, there may be benefits to you that we here are not privvy to. Give us some more info, we may have some better answers.

Terry

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

The agreement states that:

1. The lease IS NOT a lease to own.

2. As I said I pay fuel, fuel taxes, tolls, qual com, and occupational health insurance and truck insurance and I agree to have $100.00 a week taken out for ten weeks to cover my escrow account.

3. Owner pays for maintenance and all licenses.

4. Driver receives 60% of loaded miles and 100% of other things such as fuel surcharge, dentention time, deadhead, border crossing, hand unloading, and authorized empty moves.

Thanks again for your help. I really apprecite it.

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

Oh I forgot the van is leased to Panther II

terryandrene · Feb 13, 2005

If you can't negotiate 60%, you pay fuel/tolls ONLY, then run away from this deal. I agree with some escrow in a legit, interest bearing acct., but you need an agreement in writing that explains the purpose of the escrow and the conditions under which some or all of it is held back and/or returned to you.

If others on here agree with my opinion, I'd give serious thoughts to walking away from an owner who wants it all for himself. If you decide to stay with him, ask to see last years revenue stats, figure what would be left for you if you take his deal. If you're happy, we're happy.

Terry

Here's another way to look at it. If you get 2000 paid miles a week, you'll get about 46 cents per mile or $920. You'll deadhead about 30% or more so you'll travel 2600 miles @ 20+/- MPG and $1.95 per gal. You'll spend $253 a week on fuel. I'd guess at least an avg $15 for tolls. Insurance will be about $30 per week, qualcomm $37.50 and work accident ins at 2% of the gross to the owner would be another $30 per week.

If you have a good week at 2000 miles, you'd net about $554. If you take a week off, you'd still be responsible for $30+37.5+30= $97

Have an accident and you might be held liable for the deductable if you agree to pay for all insurance. That would be deductable on his van, deductable for the freight, and possibly deductable for any property damage. Also while van in shop for repairs, oil change, collision repair, you get nothing but the bills for your fixed costs.

Terry

RichM · Feb 13, 2005

Ocupational insurance is similar to Workmens Comp. If you get injured on the job they will pay you about 60% of your weekly average until you are back to work or they may have a time frame.
This insurance is something an owner should carry for you as it if you get hurt on the job you can't come back to him for damages.
One other thing,does the lease specify you as an employee or an independent contractor.I would assume the lessor want you to be an IC.

I wouldn't walk away from this deal,I would run. Good luck and let us know how you make out.

Tom Robertson · Feb 13, 2005

As an independent contractor you would be responsible for carrying and paying for your own "workers comp" or "occupational health insurance. If the owner pays this, he then becomes an employer.

Much in the same manner that it is unlikely for you to obtain insurance on someone else's vehicle, it is unlikely that an owner would or could obtian worker's comp on an independent contractor.

Either renegotiate the contract with what appears to me to be a "newbie" owner so that he pays for everything (truck insurance and qualcomm as well as all maintenance etc) or put on your track shoes.

I would also ask for the numbers of other drivers now working with this owner to check on pay, and the regularity of those payments.

This one smells a bit fishy.

raceman · Feb 13, 2005

I am an owner of straight trucks and put drivers in there without any kind of agreement like this. I would run from this deal unless you know this person and can rework it. Everyone who has responded is correct. You should get 60% of what the truck makes including any fuel surcharge. In other words, you pay for fuel and tolls and maybe oil changes. Everything else should be covered by the owner. I pay for oil changes and maint. but I do know a few people who have the drivers pay for oil changes. Not much about what you are being offered is standard. If you have told the entire story....... run don't walk to a different owner. Good Luck

Raceman
Owner Two Straight Truck.
Part time driver of one of my trucks and local TT.
15mon.OTR Expediting
1 yr local Expediting
Line Haul TT 2mon.
OTR Straight Truck Plt to Plt off and on 5 years.
Based in Cincy Ohio
Currently at Express-1

knelson35565 · Feb 13, 2005

I really appreciate everone's input and support. It is nice to know there is a place where you can turn to get a truthful answer. After seeing what you all have to say, Ithink that this is not the best situation for me right now. I have gotten several emails from people who will not post their comments on here. Very RUDE to say the least. Basically saying if I want more than is being offered, I should buy my own van. So I have about decided to do that. I think I will wait until on over in the spring and buy me a van and be an O/O. At least I know that way the only person that I have to answer to is my wife - LOL! Thanks again to all that helped out. I really do appreciate it.