Changing Times in Expediting.

[OntarioVanMan]

I think that the problem with the overloading of the vans comes from in part the carrier and in part the driver. I don't think many carriers require a weight ticket to prove what one can haul and it seems that with the common knowledge that a 2500 model sprinter hauls X at most or a GMC 3500 hauls X isn't used much if at all.

Case in point - I am going across I80 on my way to my pickup the other day and passed by a FedEx van that was squatting pretty bad, I would venture to guess there was a lot more on the van than what should be. On the way back I was passed by an E-1 sprinter in the same form and behind him a panther van who struggled to keep it on the road because it appeared he had air bags but from his actions was still a bit overloaded.

As for rates, it depends on the carrier OVM, I was looking at them lately for vans and was surprised at what the shippers are paying.

Desperate times calls for desperate measures in some of them overweight cases...they need to pay the bills and momma is needing money...the pressure is on...

Greg...surprised at rates? High - low?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

the class 7 trucks are here to stay, as they provide for an economy transport.
at 250,000$ a pop those new D units are priced out of the market for most O/O, fleets or shippers.
the new tree huggrs will stay vacan, as they reach 7 years or a million mil.
CharlesD said it best 'the load pay per load, not per truck'.
from an perspective F/O, both D & C have it's value's.
the D units have a longer lifespan, and needs to keep busy at a higher rate. the C' can seat in Laredo for Mon. no biggi.
buy less, drive less, be happy.
in a few short years, you won't be able to find a good used class 8 str8Truck. as those SCR motor out perform .
there's also a Transit in OVM future ...

Nope moose....whichever comes first...me or the van....there will be no more.....the final episode.

 

[moose]

Already planing your transition?

 

[CharlesD]

As for rates, it depends on the carrier OVM, I was looking at them lately for vans and was surprised at what the shippers are paying.

The shippers are still paying good money to move stuff. The problem is the abundance of vans and the extremely competitive bidding that goes on in some areas where there are too many of them or where people don't like to be. Sometimes you can be in New England and there might only be two or three other vehicles in a 200 mile radius and you can't get a good rate because that's one of those areas people think they have to get out of at any cost, while you can be sitting in North Carolina with 20 other vans around and get decent money.

I think things are headed more toward express LTL rather than true expedite. Case in point. There is a load right now on Sylectus that is picking up tomorrow in CA and delivering Monday in Michigan. They are requesting an air ride truck and want it delivered by noon on Monday and they're only wanting to pay $2k. That's .83 a mile for a dock high air ride truck going 2400 miles in 72 hours with a set protect time for the delivery. We'll take it if I can find another $2500 in revenue to put on there with that, but there's no way I'm giving someone exclusive use for that money. I think that's where we're headed.

 

[tumbleweeds]

My main concern with over loading a van or sprinter is... When one tail ends a bus load of nuns because he is too heavy and then the cry will go out to make all vanner's start scaling and logging. That will be the end of a very nice gig. With the Sprinter max weight at 8800# on the single rear wheel units, it does not take much to over load one. Especially if it has a bunk etc... One they had at the Expo had soooo much stuff on it, there was only 1900#s left for freight. You know someone will buy that and put 2500#s or more on it. So far the FDCC has not asked us to take over 2500#s. If you notice a FDCC van sagging low in the back end its because they run us sooooo hard our tails are draggin! ioi!
More miles begets more smiles.

 

[Bruno]

the class 7 trucks are here to stay, as they provide for an economy transport.
at 250,000$ a pop those new D units are priced out of the market for most O/O, fleets or shippers.
the new tree huggrs will stay vacan, as they reach 7 years or a million mil.
CharlesD said it best 'the load pay per load, not per truck'.
from an perspective F/O, both D & C have it's value's.
the D units have a longer lifespan, and needs to keep busy at a higher rate. the C' can seat in Laredo for Mon. no biggi.
buy less, drive less, be happy.
in a few short years, you won't be able to find a good used class 8 str8Truck. as those SCR motor out perform .
there's also a Transit in OVM future ...

Moose I disagree on the class 7 trucks. The Hino, Junk. The Freightliner M2 106, Junk. Now if the Fl 70 and Fl 80 was around with Cat motors I would say yes. We had a Hino and they are bad for fuel mileage. The M2 106 kept blowing motors at 200,000 miles. Class eight ten wheel straight trucks are the way we are going with our fleet. We can haul more weight and the drivers like them better.

 

[beachbum]

Tumbleweeds, just talked tx a Texas State last week on making under 10,000 LBS log and weight and he said no way because it would tie up the system. We talked about all the plumbers, electricians and other small trucks and vans out here that would need to scale or log and that's why he said no way.

It comes down to gumming up the system.

Now if some bonehead in DC decides that then I'll just buy a class 7 truck, because I'll never go back to being a TT driver. Period.

 

[NorthernBill]

Could it be that some sprinters look overloaded or tail heavy because the load is not balanced between the axles? I would think a 170ext. with 1,750 lb on the back would be a hand full. How sensitive are they for load placement?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Could it be that some sprinters look overloaded or tail heavy because the load is not balanced between the axles? I would think a 170ext. with 1,750 lb on the back would be a hand full. How sensitive are they for load placement?

For me personally I don't find much difference if the weight is on the tail or pushed up further forward...I can say however when reaching the upward weight like over 2,700 it rides like crap...seems to "float" over the road...steering is very sloooow....and it does not matter even if the weight is spreading out over 12 feet.....and braking distance is increased...

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Back to changing times...

It is just too bad one needs a 10 page contract just to drive...remember when a handshake and a nod was honoured...a mans word used to mean something....If this is progress, it sucks big time....

 

[60MPH]

I don't think they upped the weight because of the sprinter, they upped the weight to 2500 and beyond in order to get their trucks loaded before the next guy. I believe this has occurred as a reaction to the recession we've been experiencing, not just since 08, but since 2000-2001.

In a different economic situation, I think you'd see some different patterns.

I could tell you who one of the biggest offenders for overloading trucks is......but privately of course.

I know of one that "specialize" in loading sprinter style units with C truck freight. 3400# in a sprinter, I just roll my eyes when I see stuff like that posted.

 

[Bruno]

Back to changing times...

It is just too bad one needs a 10 page contract just to drive...remember when a handshake and a nod was honoured...a mans word used to mean something....If this is progress, it sucks big time....

Ken

I agree 100% with you on that. I could tell you things that happened to us over the years that would you would shake your head and say what is the world of drivers coming too.


One time we had a two man team that was fighting going down the road in Stow, Ohio, a half mile from my uncle Jim's truck repair shop. The co driver put the lead driver in a head lock while he was driving down the road at 45 mph causing the truck to run over two telephone poles putting the parts of Stow and Hudson Ohio without power for 24 hrs. Bruce Simpson the CEO for Roberts Express at the time wasn't happy not having power from this accident.

This was all over a driver blowing smoke in the other drivers face. The co driver went to jail, the truck had $29,000 worth of damage and was down for almost 3 months. Now you know why people have contracts.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Ken

I agree 100% with you on that. I could tell you things that happened to us over the years that would you would shake your head and say what is the world of drivers coming too.


One time we had a two man team that was fighting going down the road in Stow, Ohio, a half mile from my uncle Jim's truck repair shop. The co driver put the lead driver in a head lock while he was driving down the road at 45 mph causing the truck to run over two telephone poles putting the parts of Stow and Hudson Ohio without power for 24 hrs. Bruce Simpson the CEO for Roberts Express at the time wasn't happy not having power from this accident.

This was all over a driver blowing smoke in the other drivers face. The co driver went to jail, the truck had $29,000 worth of damage and was down for almost 3 months. Now you know why people have contracts.

Trucking has always been a cut throat gig as back as I can remember....most cases were settled in the parking lot...

and these contracts as far as I can see are almost useless....for all that we read here and on the TS lot..very few if any end up in court...

 

[cheri1122]

Ken

I agree 100% with you on that. I could tell you things that happened to us over the years that would you would shake your head and say what is the world of drivers coming too.


One time we had a two man team that was fighting going down the road in Stow, Ohio, a half mile from my uncle Jim's truck repair shop. The co driver put the lead driver in a head lock while he was driving down the road at 45 mph causing the truck to run over two telephone poles putting the parts of Stow and Hudson Ohio without power for 24 hrs. Bruce Simpson the CEO for Roberts Express at the time wasn't happy not having power from this accident.

This was all over a driver blowing smoke in the other drivers face. The co driver went to jail, the truck had $29,000 worth of damage and was down for almost 3 months. Now you know why people have contracts.

So does yours now include clauses prohibiting blowing smoke in the driver's face and the driver placing the codriver in a headlock while moving?

Seriously, you can't write a contract that stops anyone from acting stupid, and if the consequences of their actions need to be spelled out, they're too stupid to sign it anyhow.
Contracts work to prevent deliberate abuse of trust by those who can't afford to trust the unknown character of the other party. Temper tantrums are outside their area of expertise, lol. [Stories of fights between codrivers are sometimes pretty funny, you gotta admit.]

 

[greg334]

Cheri, you know you can pick out some of these idiots and not hire (contract with) them to do the job.

The real problem is that many fleet owners don't look at the cost of having idiots, they want to make those big bucks and be important in the fleet.

I've had my share of idiots, employees who for the most part did their job but it was that one moment that they would go all goofy and get fired.

 

[BigRed32771]

The shippers are still paying good money to move stuff. The problem is the abundance of vans and the extremely competitive bidding that goes on in some areas where there are too many of them or where people don't like to be. Sometimes you can be in New England and there might only be two or three other vehicles in a 200 mile radius and you can't get a good rate because that's one of those areas people think they have to get out of at any cost, while you can be sitting in North Carolina with 20 other vans around and get decent money.

I think things are headed more toward express LTL rather than true expedite. Case in point. There is a load right now on Sylectus that is picking up tomorrow in CA and delivering Monday in Michigan. They are requesting an air ride truck and want it delivered by noon on Monday and they're only wanting to pay $2k. That's .83 a mile for a dock high air ride truck going 2400 miles in 72 hours with a set protect time for the delivery. We'll take it if I can find another $2500 in revenue to put on there with that, but there's no way I'm giving someone exclusive use for that money. I think that's where we're headed.

This is close to my analysis of the present pay situation: we are expected to do exclusive use at LTL rates. I don't see this as workable economics for very long. The question is how to communicate to the shippers that if the want the whole truck they must pay for the whole truck and not just the few feet of space they actually use.

 

[greg334]

I am thinking exclusivity is not coming from the shippers as much as it is coming from the carrier which is my point. When people are advertising that you get the whole truck and then offering the whole truck, that it where people expect the whole truck.

 

[tumbleweeds]

Tumbleweeds, just talked tx a Texas State last week on making under 10,000 LBS log and weight and he said no way because it would tie up the system. We talked about all the plumbers, electricians and other small trucks and vans out here that would need to scale or log and that's why he said no way.

It comes down to gumming up the system.

Now if some bonehead in DC decides that then I'll just buy a class 7 truck, because I'll never go back to being a TT driver. Period.

I would consider going to a class 7 but my wife would not go with me. She feels like the van is big enough to handle, she has no desire to go to anything bigger. I drove a TT for 3 years prior to this and would never go back. I will wait tables a Denny's first. It would also be tough to make enough as a solo in a straight. The hours are too restrictive. So if they ever change the rules, we will move somewhere South and live on a beach. Cuz lifes a beach driving a van.