Bob Dylan and Viet Nam
- Thread starter Ragman
- Start date
purgoose10
Veteran Expediter
I think if he still smokes the stuff he used to and his high pitched worn out voice he probably will fit right in. Maybe Hanoi Jane can go over and lend him support. 
And of course stay there. Matter of fact I'll buy the two a grass hut in the country if they will. Stay that is.
And of course stay there. Matter of fact I'll buy the two a grass hut in the country if they will. Stay that is.
I would rather he perform over there than here. I can't hear him over there! That is ALWAYS a plus. Besides, he fits over there.
I couldn't care less whether Bob Dylan goes to Vietnam or not. He's going to perform in China, and I don't care about that, either. He's also going to perform in Singapore, Australia, New Zealand, England and Ireland. The one that makes me mad is his final concert date of his current tour, which is in Costa Mesa, California. How dare he go to Costa Mesa?!?!
Vietnam was a long time ago, it was a war we shouldn't have been involved with in the first place. Dylan sang songs that were anti-war, and to read what some people on here write, one could conclude they are anti-anti-war, or actual war mongers who prefer war to peace. What in the world could you possibly have against someone who simply asked the question, "What are we fighting for?" Especially since after it was all over and done with, the answer ended up being, "Nothing, really."
Vietnam was a long time ago, it was a war we shouldn't have been involved with in the first place. Dylan sang songs that were anti-war, and to read what some people on here write, one could conclude they are anti-anti-war, or actual war mongers who prefer war to peace. What in the world could you possibly have against someone who simply asked the question, "What are we fighting for?" Especially since after it was all over and done with, the answer ended up being, "Nothing, really."
Yeah, Vietnam was a civil war, right?
No Soviet involvement, no mass murders etc. <snort> No ramming chopsticks through nuns ears or raping them. Dr. Dooley was lying and the pictures he took in 1957 were "photo shopped". I think it was JUST A TAD more complicated than Dylan made it out to be. Not quite as "neat" a package as our so called "news people" made it out to be.
Should we have been there? I don't know. Should we have allowed the Soviets to enslave Eastern Europe and murder millions? I guess so, we did. Guess we should have allowed in "'Nam" as well. Eh?
But the U.S. has NO business being the world's cops. No problem. Fine by me. Bring 100% of the troops home. Do NOT interfere any where in any way shape or form.
No need to worry what China is doing in Tibet or Burma. No need to inject any aircraft or troops into Libya. Just allow the mass murders. None of our business.
OK, so what does all of that have to do with Dylan going to Vietnam in 2011 and performing? It's not like he wrote a bunch of pro-China or pro-North Vietnam songs. His songs questioned the government, which, as it turns out, needed questioning.
"But the U.S. has NO business being the world's cops. No problem. Fine by me. Bring 100% of the troops home. Do NOT interfere any where in any way shape or form."
Sarcasm noted. But all I'll say is, what if the shoe was on the other foot, and some other country, like China, or the Soviets, decided to interfere with us and what we're doing here at home, and do so militarily? Would that be OK?
If not, then why is it OK for us to think we can do whatever we want in and to other countries?
"But the U.S. has NO business being the world's cops. No problem. Fine by me. Bring 100% of the troops home. Do NOT interfere any where in any way shape or form."
Sarcasm noted. But all I'll say is, what if the shoe was on the other foot, and some other country, like China, or the Soviets, decided to interfere with us and what we're doing here at home, and do so militarily? Would that be OK?
If not, then why is it OK for us to think we can do whatever we want in and to other countries?
Nothing, I am HAPPY he performing there, I don't have to hear him. He is, in my opinion, a FAR better writer than performer. I would prefer to listen to a traffic accident that hear him play or sing.
It is a choice, Turtle. We can do NOTHING, if that is what people want, NO interference. That means NO aid of ANY kind to Libya. NO aid of any kind to Burma. NO stopping Russia as they re-expand, NO interference with China as they continue to enslave Tibet.
NO COMPLAINTS about NOT protecting people's lives.
I don't claim that the U.S. is perfect as some may think. I know we have made HORRIBLE mistakes. Every action, mistake or other wise that I was involved in was at LEAST done to TRY to stop what I thought was a WORSE action.
It is NOT possible to have it both ways. If people need protected, the weak, the enslaved, it WILL take military action. If you don't want the military involved in the world, no help.
(not you personally)
We are NOT Stalin or Mao. As bad as we might have been we have NEVER be like that. Read Dr. Dooley's books. He was NOT a good writer but he told it as it really was.
He TRIED to get the U.S. to intervene in a "different" way in S.E Asia. He was a medical DR. When he could NOT get the government to listen he left the Navy and lived in Laos working as a private citizen. He did NOT agree with our polices but also KNEW for a FACT that what the Soviets were doing there was FAR worse. His books had a MAJOR impact on me when I read them in the 8th grade. They started shaping my views. They reflected what my dad told me about the area from when he was there.
Funny. I was NOT going on about 'Nam. I was only responding to the thread. By the way, I am NOT a Dude.\ dude. You can be a "Dude" I am not.
History is VERY important and it should be taught properly. I find it amazing when I talk with people who have NEVER heard of the "Bataan Death March" or, the fact we ever FOUGHT in WWII. I have met people who have NO idea what the "Cold War" was or when it took place let alone it's connection with our involvement in Vietnam and other places world wide.
I am chilled, the walleye will be "on" soon.
It's the Bataan Death March that's making it tough for me to feel sympathetic towards the Japanese. My current audiobook is a survivor's account [Ben Steele, former Montana cowboy], and I was really getting to detest the Japanese for the barbaric way they treated Americans as dishonorable captives, rather than honorable POWs, when the earthquake struck.
I've got to put the book on hold for awhile, it makes me feel schizophrenic - can't get the emotions of past & present untangled with all that Japan is suffering now.
I've got to put the book on hold for awhile, it makes me feel schizophrenic - can't get the emotions of past & present untangled with all that Japan is suffering now.
It was Country Joe McDonald of Country Joe And The Fish that asked the question: "What are we fighting for?" Their performance of Feel Like I'm Fixing To Die at Woodstock began with the intro: "Give me an F. Give me a U...
Jon Mark and Johnny Almond asked the question: "What Am I Living For." And of course Bud Abbott and Lou Costello asked: "Who's On First."
It was the October Revolution in Russia that made it tough for me to feel sympathetic towards the Russians and the people of Chernobyl. The audio book:Ten Days that Shook the World by former journalist, socialist and human being John Reed is an eye witness account of the Russian Revolution. I'm still dealing with mixed emotions but iodized salt from Morton is helping me cope.It's the Bataan Death March that's making it tough for me to feel sympathetic towards the Japanese. My current audiobook is a survivor's account [Ben Steele, former Montana cowboy],
New Dylan? Sorry I'm still tangled up in blue.
If it were only that simple. That has always been the problem. People like short sound bites and not reality. Oil is just a small part of the problem. We COULD fix the oil problem quickly, we won't, but we could. Then pull out of the Middle East. That would, in my opinion, just postpone the fight for a few years.
People here would LOVE us to pull out but in a few short years start screaming to help those being oppressed.
The problem is people here only think VERY short term. The FIRST important thing I learned when I went into the "Business" is that EVERY problem is LONG term and NO problem will be fixed in less than 50 years OR MORE!
I've always been curious why so many people made the assertion that getting into Iraq "for the oil" was such a bad thing. Personally, I hope they did do it for the oil - it would be a win-win situation for both countries. Saddam's oil fields were a joke - outdated dysfunctional equipment, and what little oil they did manage to pump out and sell only added to the money he stole from his country.
Considering the incompetence of the current POTUS, we better be glad the US and it's oil companies are in Iraq. Since we can't drill for our own oil, we better have some good and friendly sources somewhere. On the other hand, the Iraqis are glad our oil companies are there because now they can harvest their natural resources, reinvigorate their economy with good jobs and enhance the standard of living for the entire population. The stupid notion that we sent the Marines into Iraq so we could steal their oil only lives in the minds of college students and movie stars who couldn't find Iraq on a map. We sell the Iraqis the equipment and technology, they sell us their oil at market prices - everybody's happy.
Considering the incompetence of the current POTUS, we better be glad the US and it's oil companies are in Iraq. Since we can't drill for our own oil, we better have some good and friendly sources somewhere. On the other hand, the Iraqis are glad our oil companies are there because now they can harvest their natural resources, reinvigorate their economy with good jobs and enhance the standard of living for the entire population. The stupid notion that we sent the Marines into Iraq so we could steal their oil only lives in the minds of college students and movie stars who couldn't find Iraq on a map. We sell the Iraqis the equipment and technology, they sell us their oil at market prices - everybody's happy.
It's the Bataan Death March that's making it tough for me to feel sympathetic towards the Japanese. My current audiobook is a survivor's account [Ben Steele, former Montana cowboy], and I was really getting to detest the Japanese for the barbaric way they treated Americans as dishonorable captives, rather than honorable POWs, when the earthquake struck.
I've got to put the book on hold for awhile, it makes me feel schizophrenic - can't get the emotions of past & present untangled with all that Japan is suffering now.
The People of Japan today had NOTHING to do with the Bataan Death March. I learned while I was stationed there that they are ashamed of the actions of their government. Just as the people of Nazi Germany the every day person in Japan had NO idea what their government was doing.
I found the people of Japan to be more than just friendly and they are now a close ally of ours.
My wife's uncle was also a surviver of the Death March and my Dad fought them in China, Burma and India.
Hey Turtle,
My old Army unit, THE Army Security Agency had our OWN "cutsie" song too! Sung to the "Ballad of the Green Berets"
Drunken Soldiers, Always High
Dropouts from old Sigma Phi
Men who b******t all the way,
These are the men from the ASA
Plastic cans upon our ears,
We've been cleared and
we're not Queers
One Hundred Men will test today,
But only three make the ASA
Trained to go from bar to bar,
That's the life thats best by far
Men who drink will seldom fight,
And the ASA drinks through
the night
On a Mid, a Trick Chief waits,
Four of his men are coming late
Men who drink among the best
Another drink, their last request
A teal blue scarf 'round
my son's neck
Makes my son a nervous wreck
One hundred men re-upped today,
But not a one from the ASA
Black is for the night we fear,
Blue the water we don't go near.
WHITE IS FOR THE FLAG WE FLY,
Yellow is the reason why.
Red is for the blood we've shed.
As you see, there is no red!
One hundred men reupped today.
Not a one for the A-S-A!
Below is a GREAT link. This is what our barracks sounded like after a tub or two of "Dirty Apple Juice" MUCH better than Dylan!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP514a3k13U
My old Army unit, THE Army Security Agency had our OWN "cutsie" song too! Sung to the "Ballad of the Green Berets"
Drunken Soldiers, Always High
Dropouts from old Sigma Phi
Men who b******t all the way,
These are the men from the ASA
Plastic cans upon our ears,
We've been cleared and
we're not Queers
One Hundred Men will test today,
But only three make the ASA
Trained to go from bar to bar,
That's the life thats best by far
Men who drink will seldom fight,
And the ASA drinks through
the night
On a Mid, a Trick Chief waits,
Four of his men are coming late
Men who drink among the best
Another drink, their last request
A teal blue scarf 'round
my son's neck
Makes my son a nervous wreck
One hundred men re-upped today,
But not a one from the ASA
Black is for the night we fear,
Blue the water we don't go near.
WHITE IS FOR THE FLAG WE FLY,
Yellow is the reason why.
Red is for the blood we've shed.
As you see, there is no red!
One hundred men reupped today.
Not a one for the A-S-A!
Below is a GREAT link. This is what our barracks sounded like after a tub or two of "Dirty Apple Juice" MUCH better than Dylan!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP514a3k13U
Thank you, Captain Obvious - I wonder if I'd have ever figured that out without your help.
greg334
Veteran Expediter
Actually Layout, there are a majority of Japanese who still feel that it was a provoked war and they still feel that they didn't do much wrong. It is the minority who want to treat the past as an embarrassment and have pushed for more than a superficial apology.
I understand Cheri's point.
I understand Cheri's point.