Baby butchers admitting prenatal infantacide kills a baby

pjjjjj

Veteran Expediter
Ms. Elders may know that, if she were here

Uh, oh. That's a setup for an ad hominem logical fallacy waiting to happen. Somebody with three degrees should know that. <snort>

Oh, I don't know about that. Full scholarship at 15 years of age and 3 college degrees compared to truck driving school makes it questionable who should be calling whom a moron and an idiot.
What exactly are your credentials in this debate? Please don't say life experience.
:rolleyes:

Total hypocrisy from a total moron but that's to be expected from leftist idiots like Ms. Elder.
 

OntarioVanMan

Retired Expediter
Owner/Operator

Some members may benefit from brushing up on their reading skills. OVM was speaking OF 'all you guys in here', not FOR 'all you guys in here'

Tennesseahawk
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Originally Posted by OntarioVanMan
Am speaking of all you guys in here....

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Originally Posted by OntarioVanMan
Am speaking of all you guys in here....

OntarioVanMan

OntarioVanMan


Thank you....

If more men took responsibility for birth control they could have more rights when a bad decision goes wrong ... If a guy doesn't want a baby he should practice safe sex as well as the woman....
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
they should mind their own business, unless they're the one who is pregnant, or the one who got her pregnant. The term "pro-life" should not be synonymous with "pro you'll do as I say."
If I want to murder someone in the privacy of my living room, everybody else should mind their own business. Nobody else should presume to tell me what to do.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
If I want to murder someone in the privacy of my living room, everybody else should mind their own business. Nobody else should presume to tell me what to do.

If you want to murder someone, no. If you want to have an abortion, yes.

The reason is, of course, murder is illegal, abortion is not.

It's important that the definitions of the terms you use match the same definitions that society's lexicon at-large uses.
 

asjssl

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
What about kids being born to ..doomed to a horrible crack head mom for example...I had a wonderful up bringing.. some don't get that luck...I look @ it is if ...your mom is thumbing the yellow pages for abortion... well things are not looking good...was not meant to be...mistakes are made...maybe some of these pro life people have never left Mayberry or something...there are some horrible people breeding and bringing children into a doomed life...and being born then horribly abused ...then yanked from the only life you know ..good or bad...then placed in a foster home..which is not that great of an existence anyway......now let's not kid ourselves.. all the above is on our dime...most of the pro life people are the 1st to yell about government expenditures ..I say there is 2 ways too look @ this...
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
What about kids being born to ..doomed to a horrible crack head mom for example...
It's unfortunate, but it happens.

there are some horrible people breeding and bringing children into a doomed life...
Yes, there are.

now let's not kid ourselves..
Yes, let's not. There hasn't been a time in all of human history where children have been born into a doomed life. It's the human condition. It will always be that way. No amount of money or any other remedy has ever, nor will ever, change condition. The argument in favor of abortion on such a meaningless, emotional argument as children might be born into a doomed life is, to put it mildly, utterly ridiculous. It's almost, not quite, but almost as ridiculous as the relatively recent invented religious argument against abortion. Children born of perfectly normal parentage are often nevertheless doomed to a miserable existence. The "normal" family is, in fact, the dysfunctional family. It's the human condition, whether it's a crack-whоre mommy, an alcoholic father, a religious nutjob set of parents, or, as frightening, sad and pathetic as it may be, parents who are Democrats.

Every single argument for or against abortion is predicated upon telling someone else what they can and cannot do. If you can force someone to to have a child, then you can force someone to not have one, or to use contraception or to be sterilized, and you can do so for whatever reasons you like. Forcing someone to do something against their will is an abhorrent abomination of human sensibilities and inalienable liberty.

There's yer argument, and it's one that cannot be refuted by any intelligent argument.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
If you want to murder someone, no. If you want to have an abortion, yes.

The reason is, of course, murder is illegal, abortion is not.

It's important that the definitions of the terms you use match the same definitions that society's lexicon at-large uses.
Nope. It's important to use factual definitions. Since prenatal infanticide is murder, the analogy holds.
 

asjssl

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
We require a whole permit process in the building of a house...I know it would be difficult ...why not for children..the building of our future....too many scumbags breeding...breeding... all on OUR dime...
 

asjssl

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
Nope. It's important to use factual definitions. Since prenatal infanticide is murder, the analogy holds.

You can have all the analogy you want...who are you to sentence a kid to a horrible life just because of your views...again..you want to say what these women can do...but what are you doing to help these kids being born..everybody is still forgeting that...MUST HAVE THEM!! But no infrastructure after there here...and foster and orphanages are NOT a infrastructure!!
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Nope. It's important to use factual definitions. Since prenatal infanticide is murder, the analogy holds.

False premise. And it'll be a false premise no matter how righteous and indignant you are about it.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
You can have all the analogy you want...who are you to sentence a kid to a horrible life just because of your views..
Uh, who are you to sentence them to be literally and physically ripped limb-from-limb, burned to death with acid, or any of the other horrible atrocities that occur when women don't want to be inconvenienced or, as the Kenyan-in-Chief put it, "punished with a baby."
..you want to say what these women can do...
I don't do that at all. I suppose you could make that case if I were against contraception, but I'm not fighting contraception, just infanticide.
but what are you doing to help these kids being born..everybody is still forgeting that...MUST HAVE THEM!! But no infrastructure after there here...and foster and orphanages are NOT a infrastructure!!
You'd be surprised how many great men came from orphanages. I saw a list a few years ago, and I was shocked. If orphanages are bad, it's because society allows them to be bad. If there was no prenatal infanticide and orphanages made a comeback, society would have an interest in making them far better than in the past. We became enlightened enough to enact child-labor laws, regular work weeks, overtime in most cases, even stupid things like the Family/Medical Leave Act, so we can certainly do the same for orphanages.
And we can severely reduce the number of children born orphans. Once prenatal infanticide is illegal, with penalties equal to other forms of premeditated murder, and we put an end to easy divorce, women will once again have to consider the consequences of their actions before they crawl under some guy they met at the bar. Do as you like, but you can't murder your way out of the consequences of your actions.
If you can't follow that, consider an analogy: why do we have the poverty rate that we do? Because we make it easy to be poor in America. If being poor were tough, if you had to show that you merit the privilege of forcing others to work to have their paychecks raided to buy your groceries and pay your rent, etc., and if there was a hard, unforgiving limit placed on how long and how much you could steal before you were cut off, you'd see people hustling to get a job.
Likewise, if there were no prenatal infanticide and if you had to show cause to terminate your marriage contact, you'd see people, and women in particular, start making better decisions. They'd start making sure the guy trying to upload his genetic material into her is interested in being more than a sperm donor before they let him ride.
And it doesn't take much imagination to come up with all the other benefits: lower incidence of STDs, lower costs of everything related, fewer broken homes with children damaged by divorce, fewer medical complications of abortion, etc.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
You can have all the analogy you want...who are you to sentence a kid to a horrible life just because of your views...
Here's why the emotional argument falls apart... The question you asked nearly demands a question in return, namely, who are you to sentence a fetus to death because of your views of what the future might hold for the child?

What you are in effect saying,in a very emotional way is, "It's all about the chiiiiildren! So let's kill 'em."

And that's why the pro choice people are viewed as being pro death.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
I suppose you could make that case if I were against contraception, but I'm not fighting contraception, just infanticide.
Then it would probably be better of you knew what infanticide actually meant, and used the term properly.
 

asjssl

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
well i guess in definition it is...but life is not pretty....lets not forget that...there is a line in the sand on when its done...earlier the better obliviously...but heck these people are against the plan b pill.
The state of Kansas has just about made masturbation murder with there new abortion laws...
So then there's the plan B pill...well no that's a problem.,....but NOBODY wants to raise these kids..just let them be born...but not our problem after there here ..that's my point all along...
there here now...like Kansas wrote all these new tough laws..but bet you NOT 1 lawmaker is helping take of the influx of new kids
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
well i guess in definition it is...but life is not pretty....lets not forget that...there is a line in the sand on when its done...earlier the better obliviously...
Obliviously is right. Freudian slip, I guess.
but heck these people are against the plan b pill.
As we've covered, the Morning After pill doesn't only prevent conception. If that was it, I'd be all for it. But if conception has already occurred, it prevents implantation i.e. murders a baby. So it's a no-go. If you can invent something that works another way, I'll cheer you on.
but NOBODY wants to raise these kids..just let them be born...but not our problem after there here ...but bet you NOT 1 lawmaker is helping take of the influx of new kids
This ridiculous argument again? I thought we disposed of this. There were 532 murders in Chicago last year; that I'm against murder doesn't obligate me to house & feed those who would otherwise be victims.
 

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
Obliviously is right. Freudian slip, I guess.
As we've covered, the Morning After pill doesn't only prevent conception. If that was it, I'd be all for it. But if conception has already occurred, it prevents implantation i.e. murders a baby. So it's a no-go. If you can invent something that works another way, I'll cheer you on.
This ridiculous argument again? I thought we disposed of this. There were 532 murders in Chicago last year; that I'm against murder doesn't obligate me to house & feed those who would otherwise be victims.

Hell, I thought we disposed of calling it murder, even tho it's not against the law.
 

asjssl

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
Obliviously is right. Freudian slip, I guess.
As we've covered, the Morning After pill doesn't only prevent conception. If that was it, I'd be all for it. But if conception has already occurred, it prevents implantation i.e. murders a baby. So it's a no-go. If you can invent something that works another way, I'll cheer you on.
This ridiculous argument again? I thought we disposed of this. There were 532 murders in Chicago last year; that I'm against murder doesn't obligate me to house & feed those who would otherwise be victims.

OK ....I will type .....s l o w l y...I know abortion is not pretty...never said it was...but WHO...I REPEAT...... WHO ....is RAISING ......AND........PAYING for all these kids that WILL be born???????.....be against it ...what ever.......BUT LETS BE REAL.... raising kids takes LOTS...LOTS OF ...HUGS....LOVE....$$$$.
there is not enough people willing to take the unwanted kids we have now!!!!!.so let's bring more.....there going to come...see YOU put up roadblocks everywhere.. there are gay couples to take them..but ...NOOOO.. YOU have goofy rules for every answer..
Again...its not pretty life is not pretty.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree...
 
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