And some of you want truckers with guns?

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
Kangar,
Pulling it out without the intent to use it could be the biggest mistake you could ever make. You pull that bat out and you could scare a guy who was just going to talk trash then all the sudden he feels he's on the defense, and attacks before you can attack him. Of course all of that could be avoided if people would act like adults. All I'm saying is don't pull out a weapon unless you intend on using it. I'm sure in some places the law would frown on it anyway.

I started to buy my wife a small pistol to keep in her purse. I asked her would she shot at someone if the situation arouse. She said no she would just point it at them. Now some criminals that might scare, but the pros of the cons would just get angry and pull their gun and shoot her first. So I never bought the pistol.
 

x06col

Veteran Expediter
Charter Member
Retired Expediter
US Army
Yep, lessen yer eight foot and bulletproof better stay of'n the radio, or stay in your truck, even IF it's bride and child.

Ya just never know.

Sticks and stones you know!!
 

buckeyewildman

Seasoned Expediter
Pappy your right i did stop typing to fast what i said pretty much goes for any family member but at the time of previous post i let myself get so riled up i decided to quit befor i go on a real rant
 

fortwayne

Not a Member
I wonder if the killer was the guy with the 10 year ago felony from the other post?
maybe he did get a job afterall.......
well, he has alot of freinds here, so get ready for everyone to defend him now.

Fort Wayne
 

Packmule

Expert Expediter
As for the issue of weapons, it matters not whether the scum have any guns, knives, crowbars, whatever, because they're at the wheel of one very big weapon already, no?

Cheri,

You are so dead on it!! They don't need a little gun to hurt you when they have a big 18 wheeled cannon under them. Let's face it, If someone is whizzed enough to pull a gun and kill someone, they are passed the point of reasoning. They have reached the level of insanity and will use whatever weapon is most available. IE; a truck!

I stay off the CB except in an emergency situation due to the fact that I too have a temper and don't want to give anyone the opportunity to find the right buttons to set it off.

Life is too short to rush to the finish line,

Danny
 

sanbomi1

Expert Expediter
Researching
US Army
"And some of you want truckers with guns?"

If done so legally, not a problem. Several years ago Michigan became a right to carry state. Although legally carrying a concealed weapon is still quite limited as to the places one can carry, I certainly would like to see all states recognize and honor each others CCW licenses. Some currently do now, some do not, so it is up to the individual CCW holder to check each state's laws.

Not saying it hasn't happened here in MI but I have yet to hear any reports where someone who was legally allowed to carry a concealed weapon was involved in a crime either with that weapon or with that weapon on them. My experience is that those with a Michigan CCW are extremely cautious to not do anything that would jeopardize their license. Background checks and individual training are also required before one is issued a concealed weapons permit. Those who are carrying legally are not the ones that we should be concerned with as it is typically those who are carrying illegally who are the problems.

Best regards,

Mike
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Hey wayne what're doing Wednesday morning? I'm going in for a lobotomy and have a 2 for 1 coupon I will share with you. uh, wait a sec here. A lobotomy involves surgically removing part of the brain. Uh sorry wayne. Anybody else care to join me?
 

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
Ft. Wayne you are way off there. How does forgery equal murder? He signed someone else's name so he will most likely kill next? That's a weird logic you have there bub.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
OK guy/gals why I posted this were for one reason that Robs dad stated;

“In all my years of trucking did I ever hear the language and the hatred I hear on the CB today. It used to be a caring group that would stop and help a driver, lend him a few bucks or whatever. Somehow over time the demand outweighed the supply and the company's lowered their standards and now we have everything from ex-cons to illegal immigrants hauling freight down our highways. I don't need to stay in truck stops to validate my ability to drive a truck.â€

See to me arming people in this profession is not a good idea. I think a few share my experiences and my training and will agree that the professionalism is not there with a large majority of truckers and that the industry is reaching the bottom of the barrel by using the dregs of society (not all are ex-cons) to put people in the drivers seat, so there is no reason for a trucker to have a gun for any reason.

Once upon a time there was camaraderie; there was a sense of purpose and a sense to help others when needed. Most of the old time drivers I knew and grew up with were insistent that when someone was on the side of the road, you stopped and helped. But with that, there were many adults who drove, who took this seriously and was not out there to show off their truck or make a statement but to earn a living.

But today, how many do stop?

How many times do you see a selfish attitude with cutting people off, making lane changes without reasonable space or some drivers who for any reason fly through a fuel lane only to park in half in the lane and go get something to eat?

With a firearm, the macho cr*p of the ‘real’ truck driver comes out even more; it seems to be amplified with a firearm and now there is an idea someone is tougher than someone else – better watch out. If you read the article, it was about comments made about a 10 year old who was not even his daughter.

About the news clip, my question is how anyone would know about this girl unless there was a previous encounter or they knew each other or that the girl was in the truck – which I don’t think she should be there at all. What led up to this? It wasn’t the honor of a 10 years at stake, seeing it was a girlfriend’s kid and that opens the door for other comments to be made.

I witnessed some bizarre behavior in my time but it seems that I have seen more with truckers in the last few years than I have had working in the worst areas of the world. One that was comical but serious was when I was in Arizona with a trucker who dared the clerks of a loves to stop him from stealing all kinds of stuff. I feel that if he had a gun, even legally carrying, he would have pulled it on the clerk trying to get his license number instead he tried to run this poor guy over and almost got him. By the way he ended up getting arrested but he appeared later on doing the same thing – it was like he was ##### off at Loves and wanted to take it out on the people who worked there. the truth is it was us, the patrons who actually suffered because he blocked the fuel isles every time he was there.
 

maybe_driving

Seasoned Expediter
I posted this before the change but it must have got lost.

Greg like silverdollar said what does this have to do with a gun. It was not the second amendement that was the problem be the first, so if you are willing to give up my second how about your first? I have a ccw permit from NC and it is good in 33 states. You say a gun makes a Ahole a bigger Ahole NOT!. If you are one you are one, I and any other ccw holder I know are of the old school help if you can and live like your mommy raised you be nice be kind be good......but don't be jerking my truck door open or you be dead
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
You know you seemed to miss the point.

First this is not a second amendment issue, by any means – don’t make it that. You can not find a bigger proponent for the second amendment as with me, but I firmly believe in responsible firearm ownership. But seeing some want to make it an issue, I will say this; I feel that many think that training for a CCW does not prepare people for much other than not to shoot someone accidentally. Sure they talk about it in class the instructors follow through with a good explanation and may test people to a point but after that person gets that permit, then what? They don’t continue their training; they don’t continue to prepare themselves by practicing with the weapon. Sure I know many of you do but it is not you I am worried about. for the record, I own a lot firearms but that is all I am going to say about me.

Second this is about the stupidity of human nature and the lack of common sense, again nothing to do with the second amendment or gun rights. My contention is that the trucking industry is reaching the bottom of the barrel by using the dregs of society (not all are ex-cons) to put people in the drivers seat, so there is no reason for a trucker to have a gun for any reason. It is hard to believe that many don’t care how the other drivers act when they are on the road. Here we have a fight that led to a death over a 10 year old girl that may not have been there to begin with. About the news clip, my question is how anyone would know about this girl unless there was a previous encounter or they knew each other or that the girl was in the truck? Which I don’t think she should be there at all. What led up to this? It wasn’t the honor of a 10 year old at stake, seeing it was a girlfriend’s kid and that opens the door for other comments to be made.

I don’t get the ahole thing, why do you seem to be offended about my comment?

Even the FBI has had studies they did that show people’s attitude become more intense, more arrogant and many become more confident when doing things because they have a gun. Maybe you don’t realize or they didn’t teach this to you in your CCW class that many people are more unpredictable when they are angry than other times and having a means for more control through force makes them more unpredictable and more of a problem?

Maybe you missed the point that since we are having more unprofessional people on the road in the form of truck drivers, their upbringing could be such that they may have spent more time in front of the tv playing games where they kill people, so they have more of a habitual problem determining whether situations are reality or not. I don’t have to prove my point; there is too much evidence to prove what I am saying.

So what does this have to do with a gun? A lot, think about what I am asking

Oh and one last thing, some people think that it matters that the weapon use was not a gun but in truth you can’t really hurt people with a tire iron, bat or chain while going down the road.
 
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cheri1122

Veteran Expediter
Driver

Greg, It was I who said it matters not what weapon an antisocial driver possesses, because he is at the wheel of a pretty big weapon already, no?
I can agree that the truckdrivers of today are all too often "the bottom of the barrel" (not the best environment to be a single female in, sigh) but I don't believe it's that demand has overtaken supply. I think it's because the same greed that is destroying everything America once stood for has kept the majority of the profits in the hands of the few, which attracts fewer people of good-to-excellent quality into the field every year. I don't believe the turnover rates are due to lazy or ignorant drivers, because the folks I know have a strong work ethic - they just can't keep ahead of the rising costs, when rates and FS don't rise to cover them.
It's my firm conviction that most everything that's WRONG in America can be traced back to a single cause: the love of money, aka greed.
The 'mortgage crisis' is just another example: it wasn't caused by poor folks overextending themselves to buy a better house than they could afford, as the real guilty parties would like you to believe, but by the greed of the lenders. Having sold mortgages to all the qualified applicants, they wanted more loans to repackage and sell to investors, so they began lowering the requirements, (even advertising loans with "NO income verification!" How responsible is that?) creating (deceptive) enticements for the unsophisticated, while increasing the complexity of the contracts till the poor folks didn't have any idea what they were getting into. Federal regulators did nothing, and almost every effort by states to rein in the offenders was frustrated by the lobbying money of the banks and the investors. Once again, greed prevails, and the victims get the blame, along with the shaft.
I guess this should be on the Soapbox Forum - sorry for the rant - I just get tired of seeing how easily people buy into the 'blame the victim' agenda anymore.
If carriers want more professional and better prepared and qualified o/o's & drivers, they could get them. And keep them, too - but that doesn't appear to be what they really want, when you turn on the CB anymore, does it?
 

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
Well I used to listen to the cb for the simple fact I have a sick sense of humor I guess, and would laugh at much of those guys stupidity. What always burned me though was anytime I would try to have a decent conversation with someone there would be somebody cussing us out for talking on 19. We'd just change channels. I used to really like listening to the freight haulers channel, or at least that's what I call it. It's usually ABF,FedEX Express,Yellow, and used to be Watkins and ,Overnight, and throw in a little Wal-Mart. A few other drivers get on there and they'll let you chat with them as long as you stay cool. There's is usually a couple drivers with big radios on that channel so if someone starts acting crazy they just over key him until he decides to go somewhere else. Their channel is hard to find, but it's nice to listen and talk on. Kinda reminds me of what the cb was like when I was a kid riding with my dad and grandpaw.
 

Scuba

Veteran Expediter
I have been robbed twice at gun point since i have been driving. If i was able to carry my gun they wouldn't have gotten away with it. More than likely they might not have even tried it because they prey on the people that they know cant carry. I have a cc license from my state which covers 34 states. If you pass the background check you should be treated like another person out there. But no we must be the victim class of people out there. And I don't think a driver that is trained and checked out is any more dangerous than the next guy.
 

arkjarhead

Veteran Expediter
I agree with you Scuba. I've been robbed once myself and it isn't any fun. Only when I got robbed I heard someone coming up behind me and I turned around and as soon as I did I felt a knife blade on my juggler. You know my throat. So not making any quick moves I pulled out my wallet and kindly handed him my cash. If I had had my pistol I would have been the last one he robbed. Plus I only had like 40 bucks on me so I was going to risk getting cut by fighting with him. I think I have a good pair of hands, but I don't know how well they'd work in a knife fight and I don't want to find out.
 

prescat

Expert Expediter
Getting away from the "moronic CB Rambos" part of this discussion, let's look at the ridiculous assertation Greg makes. First of all, it IS part of the second amendment discussion. Yes, it is unfortunate this incident happened, but look at ALL the trucks, in ALL the truckstops, and on ALL the roads, and guess what? In my years in the business, I've only seen a dozen or so acts of violence like fights. Wow Greg, a guy got stabbed during an argument....let's ban knives that MOST OTR drivers have. I bet if studies were performed, they would show that there are LESS actually violent acts between truck drivers, as opposed to the general population, and other large groups of co-workers. I concede there is a lot more CB trash talking and posturing in this business, but to use that incident as a catalyst to say. "Imagine guns in the hand's of truckers"...PLEASE. Let me give you another possibilty. Last month, my co-driver and I, were just about to pull into Sapp Bros in Salt Lake City, (of all places), after a drop off. We couldn't enter because of the yellow tape. Apparently shortly before, a young security guard was shot by a deranged man creating a disturbance and possibly stealing. After shooting the guard, the lunatic sat down next to him and placed the gun on a table by his side and waited for police. Drivers and employees that were in and MAY have been able to help the bleeding guard were scared to approach. Hmmm, maybe it wouldn't have been bad if a TRAINED and QUALIFIED driver had access to a weapon. Greg, I don't carry a gun in the truck because it's illegal, but I would if I were allowed and I SHOULD be able to. (Service to the Country and State should count for something). If you want to take an anti-gun stance and deny my rights, (and yes it is my 2nd Amendment right), and you have an anti-gun stance, atleast don't disguise it behind being disgusted by one incident involving 2 jerks.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Prescat
OK first things first.

The assertion that I make is gun ownership comes with responsibility and many truckers are cowboys and are not mature enough to handle a truck let alone a firearm – God what’s so hard to see the connection?

If you are observant at all, you may notice that some of these guys are aggressive and dangerous while on the road, they take more chances and are very arrogant. Do you think for a moment that this would not extend to outside of that truck if there was an absolute freedom to carry a weapon (firearm)? It would and you can’t say otherwise because that is human nature.

Second this is not a second amendment issue for me, it is a regulated industry issue and a ‘let’s take a serous look at this profession and find ways to improve it’ issue – NOT A SECOND AMENDMENT ISSUE. I am not saying we need gun control laws, I am saying that because I have and you have to operate under different rules, lets first enforce the laws we have and get these idiots off the road and put people behind the wheel who is not going to lose his/her temper because someone cut them off or take their parking space or get upset because someone touch their precious truck. You can not sit there and say that some of these people don’t act childish, they do. I said the companies out there are reaching the dregs of society to put people in the driver seat because of the high turn over, this means that person behind the wheel needs to act like a human not a grade school kid before they are allowed to have the responsibility of portable weapon. Knife, tire iron or what ever, again these are weapons but these are weapons that need to be used up close and personal, you can’t kill someone standing at one end of the line of trucks, while you are at the other end with a knife or tire iron, can you?

I bet if studies were performed, they would show that there are LESS actually violent acts between truck drivers, as opposed to the general population, and other large groups of co-workers.
Ok let’s start with the study that shows that we need strict regulations on sleep and changes of hours of service. I didn’t see the need to change the HOS or start requiring a sleep study or where truckers are falling asleep in mass do you?

It is not between the truck drivers I really worry about, it is about the truck driver who can’t handle things and go off on people. Again it is about the people who these companies hire, it is about the idiots in this profession, it is not about the weapon itself.

Again how many times do you see a trucker on someone’s a** with their truck going down the road speeding?

Where is the maturity there?

Where is the professionalism?

Third is training that you all speak of DOES NOT prepare one to be able to defend themselves. I am sorry, but the training you all get for a CCW is not enough. I am not a cop, I am not someone who has a CCW but I am one who has gone though defensive firearm training and it was not something that many can get through their head – some situations you are not able to pullout a gun and just shoot someone and being robbed in many cases, you are dealing many times with someone who is unstable to begin with. Many cops will agree with this, or at least every one I know does; they want to see people to practice with their firearm, they want people to expand their knowledge of how and when to defend themselves and they want to make sure that people know that a firearm is a responsibility as a 80,000lb vehicle is. But some people forget that they are driving 80,000lb thing that can kill.

The same with qualified, what the h*ll does that mean?

Do you take a psychological profile test to determine your ability to not lose your temper under pressure or be able to function under pressure? Not!

For the record most states say ‘Qualified’ is not being a felon, not being someone who has a record of mental problems or someone who is too young. But I don’t think this is a real issue about trained or qualified. You all brought this up as a qualifier to have a weapon because to you it is not about the driver, it is not about the profession and it is not about the people who are not mature enough to drive to begin with but it is about rights.

Forth, for the record I am pro-gun to put it simply.
  • I do not believe in the cities right to restrict guns
  • I do not believe in ‘gun free zones’ any where
  • I do not believe in any weapon type ban
  • I do not believe in zero tolerance policies for schools, where I feel
However
  • I do that there needs to be a solid purchasing system that is accessible to all with the names of people who are not allowed to purchase nor have a firearm – not the people who have one
  • I do believe that committing a crime with a fire arm should have mandatory sentences and if you kill someone, you lose your life
  • I do believe that the three day waiting period does work and for those exceptions, something can be setup to expedite a purchase
Most of all I believe that a fire arm is a crime deterrent.

AND
I have been robbed, I have been beaten and I have had a gun held to my head on more then one occasion – I was scared to death but I knew in a few of the cases, I would not have been able to use the S&W I carried at that time without getting seriously hurt or killed. In those cases, the people were not stable, they were not smart but they had confidence that they needed to do rob me.
 
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