Am I The Only One???

greg334

Veteran Expediter
I am, sometimes... sort of ...

OK,

What’s this about??

I have to sort of... sometimes.. maybe.. can possibly... agree with Diesel there.

Some of us go a little overboard with beating up of other member sometimes but with that said the openness of the forum has not any relation to the history between some whom are targets of others of the members at large simply because they sometimes bring it on themselves, like me.

I for one sometimes find it amusing to see people having differing opinions or get entertained by trying to figure out why one person is making some comments about another and then learn their history. Overall I usually take something away from most of the posts I read.

But I said this before, EO, like other forums is like a big family, extended family to be exact. There will always be people complaining (me), someone always putting others down and so on but overall when there is a heated discussion, surprisingly there is some good that comes out of it – you have to use your brain to see what is going on and what information you can get from it, nothing is given in this profession or in life in general.

As for a forum being any more friendly, well I won’t go into what I think of other forums in this profession other then to say a few have a h*ll of a lot of problems and their own little click of people who are not friendly at all. I think EO does do a very good job, not perfect but very good. But what floors me the most is the complaints about the posts and no one actually leading by example.

Now one last thing that I have to ask for the people who seem to complain about it, what do you expect? You work and live in a profession that is part of the trucking profession, it is not like doctors and lawyers getting together and conversing in a country club setting. Many who are surrounding me right now are not what I would call Sunday social types, like the guy standing to the right of my truck in his under shorts, shirtless with sandals on - such professionalism there if you know what I mean. I can discuss this at great lengths with a lot of examples and even a few pictures, but don’t forget we, EO members actually try to be above all of that and at times have to vent, which leads to a lot of ‘discussions’.

Ok?

Manlaw, glad I didn’t chase you away but I find something in your post a little funny “I will not participate in the negative attitude, it only leads to MORE negativity.†- should I quote your comment in another post?
 

are12

Expert Expediter
RE: I am, sometimes... sort of ...

I know I haven't been on here in a few days, what have I missed that got this whole topic started?

I must agree with Gregg about how EO is like a big extended family. And like all families, there will be disagreement's, quarrels and temper tantrum's but that is what makes a family.

Not everyone can think alike or always agree on things so we read about everyone's good times, bad times and b****ing and complaining. We hear where people have been, where they are going and even what some of their future plans are. Member's ask questions, answer questions and some pick on one another. It's almost like being at home.:+ :+

And it seems we all take turns in getting our hand slapped and told that we have been bold.}> }> I can just feel the love, can't you??

I, for one, look forward to coming on here and reading all the different answer's to one simple question. We just have to remember, everyone does things differently so just because you do not agree, doesn't make you right or wrong - it just makes you different. But if we all agreed on everything, this would be a very boring forum.

So, learn what you can, read what you want and ignore the rest!
 

fortwayne

Not a Member
RE: I am, sometimes... sort of ...

Old vs New........so true......the problem is the Old controls and dictates this site...afterall they own it or work for those that do.....thus it is their control tool......Old vs New, nothing will change, that is why I just now laugh instead of getting all bent out of shape.
Me!


Fort Wayne
Now That Is Stupid!
 

Dreamer

Administrator Emeritus
Charter Member
RE: I am, sometimes... sort of ...

Now that's funny! Someone proved my point, and dieseldiva's in the same post.

Thank you for the sterling example :)


Greg and Arlene, great posts!

But, as Dave alluded to, some people can't handle people disagreeing with them.. and if you do, you're attacking them personally, NOT what they said.


Thanks for the great responses folks, and without sounding TOO much like a politician..LOL.. everyone together will make a difference, and the people who can't answer a post without being negative... well, they'll just get bored of talking to themselves.


Dreamer
Forums Administrator


--------------

"The present is what slips by us while we're pondering the past and worrying about the future."

- Ziggy

 

Critter Truckin

Expert Expediter
I, personally, would think the idea of an 'open' forum would be to facilitate open debate. We all compare and argue our points. Some are right, some aren't. We can't be right 100% of the time. Even Ken Jennings lost on Jeopardy at some time. If something gets too personal, or to the point of ridiculous, then we have the option of addressing it ourselves (within reason) or letting a mod take care of it. It's really not that hard of a concept. I've been peed on indirectly. And I'm sure that I'll do the peeing at some time. Fact still remains the same. IT'S THE INTERNET!!! If this is something to get worked over about, remember these words. With no offense to anyone it may effect........

Fighting on the internet is like winning the Special Olympics... even if you win, you're still a retard!
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Dieseldiva, I'm sorry you are sick of all this. Here's a great big hug for you. xxxxxxxxxxxxx. Are x's hugs or kisses?

I agree with everything you stated. It very nice of you to take the time to tell it like it is. Thank you.

Turtle, I appreciate it when you come out of your shell and post here. I agree with everything you have to say.

Cheri, thank you for you cheery comments. You are a very mod, mod and I agree with everything you moderate. Moderation in moderation is a good thing.

Buckeye, your comments are wild man, but right on dude! I agree with everything you say.

Mike C, I give you an A+ for your valuable contributions to this
forum. I agree with all of your ideas.

Pac, I like your Pacvan and plan to build one exactly like it only mine will have black tires.

Jeff, All of your posts are accurate and helpful. I agree with everything you say. Plus you have a cute dog.

Highway Star, I want to shine just like you.

Tiger, what can I say but you'rrrrrrrrrrrrre grrrrrrrrrreat!

FtWayne, thanks for holding down the fort with your level headed comments. I agree with everything you say.

Fireball X06, your comments and insights blast me into outer space and make me want to cut my strings and go it alone.

JoeBob, you are an inspiration to us all. Seeing a man with only one foot accomplish what you have is wonderful and inspiring.

Manlaw, I agree with all of your many mainly manly posts.

RichM, thank you for sharing your rich wealth of knowledge and that extra "g"

Dreamer, I go to bed at night and sleep well knowing that you have things under control and of course I agree with everything you do and say.

Broom, I can't count how many time I have been swept off my feet by your valuable information. I agree with all of your great posts.

Greg, I am so in tune with you and your ideas that we even share the same first name.

are12, m not,but I do agree with all of your ideas.

Silverdollar, If I had but a penny for all of your wonderful posts and ideas I would be a RichM an.

Critter, what can I say, but your the best. I follow all your ideas and suggestions.

Here's hugs and kisses to all. You all are the best and I agree with everything you post. I have to go do some electrical work on my van and maybe stick a probe in my eye. I love you all and please don't pee on my parade.
 

Steady Eddie

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
No you are not the only one.

And well said by the way.



Steady

"The windshield is bigger than the rear view mirror, because it is more important to see where you are going than where you have been"
 

highway star

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
Dang it Moot!! I got tears all over my keyboard! Well, it needed to be cleaned anyway.

Diva, do you go to any other open forums? I do, once in a while, and the civility of EO is 2nd to none. Just because every once in a while someone can't help but say, "c'mon dude, you can't be serious", doesn't mean we're a bunch of cold, mean people. It means we're human and call it as we see it sometimes. I'll even throw myself under the bus with an example. A driver for a fleet owner came on and said he was driving an auto-shift with a clutch and he didn't like having to use the clutch to get rolling and could someone hook him up with a truck with no clutch. I just couldn't help but poke fun at this level of primadonnaism (hey, I just invented a word!). I mean, if you don't buy your own truck, how picky can you be? I realize as a stereotypical society we're on the soft and lazy side, but that's just too much.

So, we need to let personalities be themselves and the mods do that very well here. And it's not just the Mods. The general membership will jump on people that they feel are getting out of line. This thread has made for some interesting reading. That's what happens when people freely debate.
 

ATeam

Senior Member
Retired Expediter
Dreamer said, "If you want to see things change, be a part of that solution."

OK. Challenge accepted. I offer two specific suggestions that I GUARANTEE will improve the quality of life and discourse for all forum members (expcept those who are into and actually enjoy the soap opera aspect that the EO Open Foum facilitates in its present state).

Both suggestions can be instantly and easily implemented by the moderators. Both suggestions are easily understood. While some grey area always exists in human discourse, these suggestions are clear. Among people of good will and intent, few disagreements would rise about what is grey, what is clear, and how to deal with the grey.

Suggestion 1. Create a forum entitled "Off Topic." Use it as a dumping ground for posts made within a thread that are off topic. Do not delete the off-topic posts, but move them to the Off Topic forum. In their place, leave a link to the post with the message, "Reply moved to Off Topic forum." That protects moderators from charges of censorship since the post is not deleted or hidden. It is just moved to keep the original thread on topic.

People who wish to follow the link and respond to the off topic post remain free to do so there. People making off-topic posts remain free to reword their posts to bring them back on topic and repost in the original thread. People wishing to discuss a new topic or ask a new question that came to mind while reading the original post, can start a new thread if the new topic or question would be off topic in the original thread.

Suggestion 2. ANYTIME a post gets negatively personal, delete it. This will make the open forum an open forum of ideas, not personalities. This will require an agreement among moderators as to what "negatively personal" is. That is easily accomplished by having moderators study an article about civility and decorum in online discourse, and then, behind the scenes, run and discuss a handful of hypothetical case study posts to develop a commonly understood set of interpretations and practices. If the moderators do not know how to do this, I can teach them and hereby offer to do so. (Remember, Dreamer asked for solutions).

If you implement these two suggestions, people will quickly adjust and the quality of the Open Forum will improve. As an experiment, you could try it for thirty days.

Allow me to demonstrate how the Open Forum would be different if the two suggestions are implemented. Please refer to the thread, "A Question For Expediting Veterans About Recession."

http://www.expeditersonline.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/6118.html

I started this thread on August 16. It has 21 replies to date.

Reply 1: Off topic. It did not answer the question asked in the original post. It was not offered by someone who even knows what a recession is. Move it to the Off Topic forum.

Reply 2: Off topic. It makes a political statement instead of answering the question originally asked. Move it to the Off Topic forum.

Reply 3: Personal insult. Delete the post.

Reply 4: On Topic. Retain the post. Grey area here. The post was made not by an expediting veteran who has survived a recession, but by someone who has not yet been through a recession as an expediter. The original post was a question for recession veterans. Reply 4 could be moved to the Off Topic forum depending on moderator judgement, and how strict they choose to be regarding grey-area posts. A strict interpretation would be to move it to Off Topic.

Reply 5: On Topic. Retain the post.

Reply 6: Same as reply 4.

Reply 7: On topic. Retain the post. It is made by the person who originated the thread and elaborates on the first post.

Reply 8: On topic. Retain the post.

Reply 9: On topic and off topic. This two-paragraph post is half-and-half. Without the first paragraph, it is on topic. Being strict on on-topic enforcement, move the post to Off Topic. To avoid charges of censorship, do not edit the post. Move it to Off Topic and leave the member free to reword his reply and repost in the original thread.

Reply 10: Response to reply 9. With reply 9 moved to Off Topic, the response would have been made there, or not at all. Original thread remains on topic.

Reply 11: Refers back to 9 and 10. This post would probably not exist if reply 9 had been moved to Off Topic. The thread is beginning to go south here. The writer's Reply 11 is mostly on-topic except for his last three sentences, which I, as a moderator, would consider off topic at least and probably a personal insult. Moderators cannot know the minds of the posters, so they do not know if the writer in this case intended it as an insult or not. But moderators do know what kind of reply would be required to answer the last three sentences. That reply would be personal and off topic. In this case, it is negatively personal, not because an overt insult was clearly made, but because it is personal and it takes the thread off the original topic, which is surviving a recession.

Reply 12: Another reply that would not exist in this thread if reply 9 had been moved to Off Topic.

Reply 13: On topic. Retain the post.

Reply 14: Response to Reply 11. Reply 14 would not exist in this thread if reply 9 was moved to Off Topic. Original thread would remain on topic and free of personal tug-of-wars.

Reply: 15: Same as reply 9.

Reply 16: Same as reply 4.

Reply 17: On topic. Retain the post.

Reply 18: Same as reply 2.

Reply 19: On topic. Retain the post. In this case, I do not know if the writer has survived a recession as an expediter. Moderators will not always know the background the posters have. Since the post is on topic and includes no negatively personal content, give the writer the benefit of the doubt and retain the post.

Reply 20: This is an off-topic reply to an off-topic question earlier asked. Reply 20 would not exist if Reply 15 did not exist. Reply 15 would not exist if Reply 14 did not exist. And reply 14 would not exist if Reply 11 had been dealt with as suggested above (see Reply 11).

Reply 21: Off topic. Move it to the Off Topic forum.

Notice that with every post, there are only a few things that can happen. A post is either on topic, off topic, half-and-half, negatively personal, and/or grey. With a little practice, it would be a simple matter for moderators to quickly rin each post through this filter and act accordingly. In a week or two, members will catch on and adapt to the new style.

Even the soap opera aspect of EO would be preserved. While the example thread above would be reduced from 21 posts to five posts that are squarely on topic and free of negativly personal content, the soap opera crowd can have their fun in the Off Topic forum.

That is not to say that the soap opera crowd would be given a blank check to whoop it up. Once they are all gathered together in the same place, they can be taught about the difference between attacking a man and attacking an man's ideas. They can be taught to talk about issues not in terms of who is good or bad, but in terms of how the idea or action then being discussed is good or bad for expediters and the expediting industry.

With these two suggestions implemented, I believe members will learn how to post in a way that keeps their words out of the Off Topic bin, and instead in front of reader eyes who are seeking to learn more about the topics being discussed. Readers who do not post will find it easier to use the Open Forum for a very good purpose; namely, to reasearch and learn more about expediting.
 

Broompilot

Veteran Expediter
Moot, now I gotta go get my broom just to sweep the Bull off my boots. Fun reading though.

As for chaning anything on here. I like it the way it is nothings perfect and subjects do get to a different direction now and than.

So do one on one conversations. Is that really a BIG DEAL?
 

Packmule

Expert Expediter
Moot,

Way to go!! I feel the love!!! Man it looks like you are keeping up your liquid requirements for the project at hand. Try not to light anything up.

Danny

BTW, Good luck finding Black wheels, I looked for months but couldn't find any.
 

greg334

Veteran Expediter
Phil,

I am not very good at explaining the rational of some forums to those who have never been in the driver’s seat but I will try to do so.

The problem with your illustration, which is very good, does not lend itself to the ideals of what a true forum is about. What I mean in examining the posts themselves, the question is lost more than if it was the posts themselves had nothing to do with the question.

What I mean is that everyone will view a question, in this case about a recession imagined or otherwise and people from different backgrounds and qualifications gave their opinion. No matter how you cut it the effectiveness of the thread was not lost with the negative or otherwise ‘off topic’ replies. I can point to the thread that Firegears posted asking about what it the type of freight you haul and my comment was simplistic in it’s nature but truthful and to the point. I wasn’t trying to be a smart a** but rather giving a proper answer to a question but still being ambiguously in the specifics of the answer to protect the customers I serve. What followed seemed to be mess of posts and following your prescription, which is well thought out, my post would have ended up somewhere else, I would have reposted to make a point and ended up frustrated moving on to another site with the question only being answered in a more specific manner.

What I have told others who stepped into my shoes after moderating other sites is simply let the threads take a course with civility and the forum will provide the answers others are seeking – that is the very short version of my speech.

Moot, I told you, you were a philosopher
 

Moot

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
I agree with Phil, I think I will use a 60 amp fuse with a weather proof holder.
 

pelicn

Veteran Expediter
35 responses to this thread, and Arlene has the best solution

learn what you can, read what you want and ignore the rest!

Thank you Arlene.

Of course that's only my opinion, and you know what opinions are like, so carry on ;)
 

FireGears

Expert Expediter
My "DEAR FORUM FRIENDS"...

Since my behavior has been MOD-ified..

all I can do is quote
one of America's greatest Kings...

People.. Can't we all just get along..??..!!

KEEP SMILING and STAY FROSTY ... :+ :+

plus
 
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