What is 2nd seat vs Team Driver?

[chiefinman]

Okay I have a friend who is an O/O and he has asked me to team with him. I got my permit and talked to his carrier. His carrier said that I can come on board with them but that until I get my regular license I will be considered 2nd seat and not a team driver. What is the difference and is this a good idea?

 

[Turtle]

The difference is, if you only have a permit, you cannot drive a CMV without a licensed driver sitting there, On Duty, right next to you. You can never be On Duty Driving while he's Off Duty in the sleeper berth, for example. He must remain On Duty whenever you are behind the wheel. So, he's On Duty while he's driving, and he's also On Duty while you're driving. That's essentially a solo driver, not a team operation.

Whether it's a good idea or not depends on whether you want to use the permit to obtain an actual CDL. If you do, then it's a great idea. It lets you learn how to drive a CMV in preparation for the CDL Road Test. A couple or three weeks (or months) driving with a permit should make the Road Test a breeze.

Also driving a CMV without a CDL, like, with just a permit and no licensed CDL holder sitting there next to you, could get you a civil penalty of up to US$2,500 per incidence or, in aggravated cases (traffic violation, accident), criminal penalties of up to US$5,000 in fines and/or up to 90 days in prison. A carrier is also subject to a penalty of up to US$10,000 if they knowingly permit a driver to operate a CMV without a valid CDL. That's why you'll be a Second Seat and not a Team Driver until you get your CDL.

In most states a CDL permit is good for 6 months, but in some they are good for a year. Far as I know, in the states where the permit is good for 6 months, you are allowed to take one road test on an expired permit, but the ones where the permit is good for a year you will need to take the road test before the permit expires, or else apply for another permit.

If someone is willing to take you on as a Second Seat with a permit, you should strongly considering doing so until you are ready to take the road test and obtain your CDL. Otherwise, there's always truck driving school.

 

[chiefinman]

Thank you. That is great information. So based on that I assume that we, essentially could only use his hours. That when he is out of hours, we both are. I am still going to drive with him but now I am not sure how I will get paid.

 

[Turtle]

Thank you. That is great information. So based on that I assume that we, essentially could only use his hours. That when he is out of hours, we both are.

Correct.

I am still going to drive with him but now I am not sure how I will get paid.

I'm not, either. I'm in a cargo van with a CDL C and only had the permit for 3 or 4 days before I took the road test and got the CDL. But I would think anything you get paid is better than you having to pay him to teach you how to drive a big truck, which is exactly what happens in truck driving school.

I honestly don't know how it works when an instructor is sitting next to you while you're driving, if the instructor must log On Duty Driving, even though he's not actually driving, of if he logs simply as On Duty (Not Driving). Maybe someone else will chime in on that one. But if he can log your driving time as On Duty Not Driving, then there's a couple or three hours there on his 14 hour clock where you could extend his 11 driving clock (well, 10½ clock now). You'd probably get full pay, or close to it, for those 2 or 3 hours of driving. But since everything you get paid will be coming out of his pocket, I wouldn't expect much in the way of pay in such a learning situation. And in expediting, those times where his hour can be extended by your driving, and results in extra income to the truck, are likely to be rare.

 

[BigCat]

Correct.

I'm not, either. I'm in a cargo van with a CDL C and only had the permit for 3 or 4 days before I took the road test and got the CDL. But I would think anything you get paid is better than you having to pay him to teach you how to drive a big truck, which is exactly what happens in truck driving school.

I honestly don't know how it works when an instructor is sitting next to you while you're driving, if the instructor must log On Duty Driving, even though he's not actually driving, of if he logs simply as On Duty (Not Driving). Maybe someone else will chime in on that one. But if he can log your driving time as On Duty Not Driving, then there's a couple or three hours there on his 14 hour clock where you could extend his 11 driving clock (well, 10½ clock now). You'd probably get full pay, or close to it, for those 2 or 3 hours of driving. But since everything you get paid will be coming out of his pocket, I wouldn't expect much in the way of pay in such a learning situation. And in expediting, those times where his hour can be extended by your driving, and results in extra income to the truck, are likely to be rare.

What are you referring to a 10.5 hour clock?

 

[Turtle]

What are you referring to a 10.5 hour clock?

Sarcasm over the 30 minute break.

 

[chiefinman]

Correct.

I'm not, either. I'm in a cargo van with a CDL C and only had the permit for 3 or 4 days before I took the road test and got the CDL. But I would think anything you get paid is better than you having to pay him to teach you how to drive a big truck, which is exactly what happens in truck driving school.

I honestly don't know how it works when an instructor is sitting next to you while you're driving, if the instructor must log On Duty Driving, even though he's not actually driving, of if he logs simply as On Duty (Not Driving). Maybe someone else will chime in on that one. But if he can log your driving time as On Duty Not Driving, then there's a couple or three hours there on his 14 hour clock where you could extend his 11 driving clock (well, 10½ clock now). You'd probably get full pay, or close to it, for those 2 or 3 hours of driving. But since everything you get paid will be coming out of his pocket, I wouldn't expect much in the way of pay in such a learning situation. And in expediting, those times where his hour can be extended by your driving, and results in extra income to the truck, are likely to be rare.

He said that he would pay me a 65/35 split until I get my CDL and then it would be a 60/40 split. I am going to the DMV on Monday to schedule the road test. When I was there getting my permit last week I got a glance at their calendar and noticed that it would be the end of August or first week of September before I could get an appointment.

 

[Turtle]

He said that he would pay me a 65/35 split until I get my CDL and then it would be a 60/40 split.

Yeah, I'd jump all over that one. An awesome deal.

I am going to the DMV on Monday to schedule the road test. When I was there getting my permit last week I got a glance at their calendar and noticed that it would be the end of August or first week of September before I could get an appointment.

I don't know if this is a tractor-trailer or a straight, but if it's a straight you should be ready for the road test in just a few weeks. Good luck!