The Sins Of The Fathers ...

[asjssl]

Should I have started a new topic on arguing punctuation..do not want to be yelled @ ..

#offtopicgestapo

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[RLENT]

See Thread Title

See the definition of what constitutes a declarative sentence.

Hint: Noun phrases (?) that comprise some portion of the sentence's subject don't qualify AFAIK ...

Further the use of "or" would seem to indicate the possibility that the thing preceding it was declared only as a possibility ...

You did write it, specifically.

I wrote what I wrote ... your interpretation/understanding of it is faulty however.

True enough the "or something" implies and allows for an infinite number of possibilities, but only right up to the point where you slapped a colon at the end of it. A colon is used to explain or start an enumeration (to mention separately, a list, specify one by one).

Yes - that is one use of it ... but it's not the only one.

You enumerated no other possibilities, and thus allowed for none.

Wrong.

I used it in the syntactical-deductive where:

"The colon introduces the logical consequence, or effect, of a fact stated before."

One might posit that in lieu of actual facts, possibilities might be allowed as well.

(If this is totally outside of the realm of acceptable punctuation and grammatical construction and usage, then I hereby submit my humble apology and ask for forgiveness for the grievous sin of improper grammar and/or punctuation ...)

The possibilities stated were "The sins of the father ... or something" (undefined, particular specifics unknown)

The logical consequence was the suicide.

The possibilities were, and remain, infinite.

Further, from Colons Punctuation Rules:

Rule 4

Use a colon instead of a semicolon between two sentences when the second sentence explains or illustrates the first sentence and no coordinating conjunction is being used to connect the sentences. If only one sentence follows the colon, do not capitalize the first word of the new sentence. If two or more sentences follow the colon, capitalize the first word of each sentence following.

Again: my humble apologies to the grammar and punctuation gods ... whoever they might be ...

 

[RLENT]

You just have to be right...and have the last word...

You might be onto something there ...

 

[Turtle]

See the definition of what constitutes a declarative sentence.

Hint: Noun phrases (?) that comprise some portion of the sentence's subject don't qualify AFAIK ...

I'm well aware of what a declarative sentence is. Your thread title was split into two parts, connected by a series of periods (ellipsis) indicating a pause and flow of a sentence, ending with a colon and the following enumeration. It's all one declarative sentence, all one statement. It's a common way to start a thread or post a reply (when using the thread title as part of your sentence), and there's nothing wrong with it.

Further the use of "or" would seem to indicate the possibility that the thing preceding it was declared only as a possibility ...

If your sentence had ended with a period, you're right. If you want to squeeze out the meaning from other uses of the colon, then those other possibilities can only come from the object of the sentence, and not from anything within a prepositional phrase. We're left with "sin" or something else of the father. In either case, the father did it. More possibilities, but hardly infinite.

I wrote what I wrote ... your interpretation/understanding of it is faulty however.

You wrote something with a specific syntax which conveys a specific meaning, and now you want to blame the reader because they failed to recognize and understand that syntax to mean something that you didn't actually write? Really?

Yes - that is one use of it ... but it's not the only one.

No, it's not the only one, but it's how you used it. Intentionally or not.

Wrong.

I used it in the syntactical-deductive where:

The colon introduces the logical consequence, or effect, of a fact stated before.

If that's true, then what you did was state as a fact that the sins of the father, or something else the father did, caused the suicide.

One might posit that in lieu of actual facts, possibilities might be allowed as well.

Well which is it? A logical consequence of an effect of fact stated before, or an enumeration of the effects of the fact you gave?

(If this is totally outside of the realm of acceptable grammatical construction and usage, then I hereby submit my humble apology and ask for forgiveness for the grievous sin of improper grammar ...)

Apology accepted. But the only sin was arguing pedantical exactness (allowing for other possibilities) when the same pedantical exactness you penned made such allowances impossible.

The possibilities stated were "The sins of the father ... or something" (undefined, particular specifics unknown)

I'm quite sure at this point that that's what you meant to say, or convey, but the colon nevertheless changed that meaning. As stated without a colon, the "something" still refers directly back to the object, "the sins," or something else the father did. The colon gave us the only enumerated possibility. Other suggested uses of the colon don't give us the meaning you were trying to imply.

The logical consequence was the suicide.

The possibilities were, and remain, infinite.

It might be the logical consequence of what you were trying to say, within the limited scope of the sins of the fathers, but for it to be a logical consequence, no assumptions can be made. If the possibilities were, and remain infinite, then no logical consequence can be reached at all, only speculative guesses. Logic is the use of valid reasoning or argumentation in some activity. If you wanted to discuss the possibilities of cause and effect, you probably should have stated them as possibilities instead of flatly giving us the cause and effect.

Further, from Colons Punctuation Rules:

Well, if you used it under Rule 4, then you are again back to the only possibilities being the sins of the father or something else the father did which caused the suicide, and not an infinite number of possibilities.

In my initial reply I even gave you the benefit of the doubt as to allowing more possibilities, but your reply to that right quick narrowed down the possibilities to being only that of the effects of the sins of the father, clearing up any possible misunderstanding of the use of the colon to be anything other than that of the onset of an enumeration.

 

[witness23]

I'm well aware of what a declarative sentence is. Your thread title was split into two parts, connected by a series of periods (ellipsis) indicating a pause and flow of a sentence, ending with a colon and the following enumeration. It's all one declarative sentence, all one statement. It's a common way to start a thread or post a reply (when using the thread title as part of your sentence), and there's nothing wrong with it.

If your sentence had ended with a period, you're right. If you want to squeeze out the meaning from other uses of the colon, then those other possibilities can only come from the object of the sentence, and not from anything within a prepositional phrase. We're left with "sin" or something else of the father. In either case, the father did it. More possibilities, but hardly infinite.

You wrote something with a specific syntax which conveys a specific meaning, and now you want to blame the reader because they failed to recognize and understand that syntax to mean something that you didn't actually write? Really?

No, it's not the only one, but it's how you used it. Intentionally or not.

If that's true, then what you did was state as a fact that the sins of the father, or something else the father did, caused the suicide.

Well which is it? A logical consequence of an effect of fact stated before, or an enumeration of the effects of the fact you gave?

Apology accepted. But the only sin was arguing pedantical exactness (allowing for other possibilities) when the same pedantical exactness you penned made such allowances impossible.

I'm quite sure at this point that that's what you meant to say, or convey, but the colon nevertheless changed that meaning. As stated without a colon, the "something" still refers directly back to the object, "the sins," or something else the father did. The colon gave us the only enumerated possibility. Other suggested uses of the colon don't give us the meaning you were trying to imply.

It might be the logical consequence of what you were trying to say, within the limited scope of the sins of the fathers, but for it to be a logical consequence, no assumptions can be made. If the possibilities were, and remain infinite, then no logical consequence can be reached at all, only speculative guesses. Logic is the use of valid reasoning or argumentation in some activity. If you wanted to discuss the possibilities of cause and effect, you probably should have stated them as possibilities instead of flatly giving us the cause and effect.

Well, if you used it under Rule 4, then you are again back to the only possibilities being the sins of the father or something else the father did which caused the suicide, and not an infinite number of possibilities.

In my initial reply I even gave you the benefit of the doubt as to allowing more possibilities, but your reply to that right quick narrowed down the possibilities to being only that of the effects of the sins of the father, clearing up any possible misunderstanding of the use of the colon to be anything other than that of the onset of an enumeration.

My Lord, you misinterpreted what the man was implying and he has exhaustingly tried to explain it to you. Let it go already, you're looking quite foolish at this point.

 

[asjssl]

I'm well aware of what a declarative sentence is. Your thread title was split into two parts, connected by a series of periods (ellipsis) indicating a pause and flow of a sentence, ending with a colon and the following enumeration. It's all one declarative sentence, all one statement. It's a common way to start a thread or post a reply (when using the thread title as part of your sentence), and there's nothing wrong with it.

If your sentence had ended with a period, you're right. If you want to squeeze out the meaning from other uses of the colon, then those other possibilities can only come from the object of the sentence, and not from anything within a prepositional phrase. We're left with "sin" or something else of the father. In either case, the father did it. More possibilities, but hardly infinite.

You wrote something with a specific syntax which conveys a specific meaning, and now you want to blame the reader because they failed to recognize and understand that syntax to mean something that you didn't actually write? Really?

No, it's not the only one, but it's how you used it. Intentionally or not.

If that's true, then what you did was state as a fact that the sins of the father, or something else the father did, caused the suicide.

Well which is it? A logical consequence of an effect of fact stated before, or an enumeration of the effects of the fact you gave?

Apology accepted. But the only sin was arguing pedantical exactness (allowing for other possibilities) when the same pedantical exactness you penned made such allowances impossible.

I'm quite sure at this point that that's what you meant to say, or convey, but the colon nevertheless changed that meaning. As stated without a colon, the "something" still refers directly back to the object, "the sins," or something else the father did. The colon gave us the only enumerated possibility. Other suggested uses of the colon don't give us the meaning you were trying to imply.

It might be the logical consequence of what you were trying to say, within the limited scope of the sins of the fathers, but for it to be a logical consequence, no assumptions can be made. If the possibilities were, and remain infinite, then no logical consequence can be reached at all, only speculative guesses. Logic is the use of valid reasoning or argumentation in some activity. If you wanted to discuss the possibilities of cause and effect, you probably should have stated them as possibilities instead of flatly giving us the cause and effect.

Well, if you used it under Rule 4, then you are again back to the only possibilities being the sins of the father or something else the father did which caused the suicide, and not an infinite number of possibilities.

In my initial reply I even gave you the benefit of the doubt as to allowing more possibilities, but your reply to that right quick narrowed down the possibilities to being only that of the effects of the sins of the father, clearing up any possible misunderstanding of the use of the colon to be anything other than that of the onset of an enumeration.

Your smarter...you win!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#lastwordgestspo

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[Turtle]

My Lord, you misinterpreted what the man was implying and he has exhaustingly tried to explain it to you. Let it go already, you're looking quite foolish at this point.

Thank you for your usual Johnny-come-lately insightful input into a thread.

 

[Turtle]

Your smarter...you win!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#lastwordgestspo

And you're trolling.
#youbetchachildish
#dumbanddumbertwomintsinone

 

[asjssl]

I didnt think ; the moderators job ` was to : put members down )in o obvious ) attempt to raise the self esteem ¿

Does"nt seem good for business,
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[witness23]

Thank you for your usual Johnny-come-lately insightful input into a thread.

Anytime.

Unfortunately you've turned the thread into a punctuation p*ssing match that has left no room for insightful input.

 

[RLENT]

Just so we're on the same page:

What is the prepositional phrase that you believe I'm trying to "derive meaning" from?

 

[Turtle]

I didnt think ; the moderators job ` was to : put members down )in o obvious ) attempt to raise the self esteem ¿

Does"nt seem good for business,

Your first post in this thread was made solely to attack me, and now you're whining? Don't dish it out if you can't take it.

#crybaby

 

[asjssl]

Your first post in this thread was made solely to attack me, and now you're whining? Don't dish it out if you can't take it.

#crybaby

No..it was to point out your out of control ego..really you have to write 3 paragraphs about proper punctuation...
No crying here...just the facts..

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[Turtle]

No..it was to point out your out of control ego..really you have to write 3 paragraphs about proper punctuation...
No crying here...just the facts..

Sent from my DROID RAZR using EO Forums mobile app

Telling me what you attacked me about doesn't make it NOT an attack.

 

[RLENT]

Telling me what you attacked me about doesn't make it NOT an attack.

Ahhh ... when ya get a second and can spare a moment:

Just so we're on the same page:

What is the prepositional phrase that you believe I'm trying to "derive meaning" from?

 

[Turtle]

Sorry. I thought it was a trick question... or something... since what you wrote only contains a single propositional phrase.

 

[asjssl]

Telling me what you attacked me about doesn't make it NOT an attack.

You can call it anything you want...again pointing out that YOU are person of authority in this little online world....so I would think you would not lower yourself to put others down to make sure you always have the last word and play your IQ wars with everybody...
We get it your smart..we are not..you have tons of useful information ..but the long winded answers and the talking to people like we are beneath you comes across bad...I would think Lawrence would not want representative of his business talking to his customers ( we are his customers) in that manner...I could be wrong...


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[RLENT]

Sorry. I thought it was a trick question ... or something ...

Well, yes ... it was something: a simple question, posed to ensure that I understood what you were referring to.

Is there some reason you won't answer the question ?

 

[Humble2drive]

Fact is, I know of very few suicides are the result of what one's father did. I know of none, actually.

I believe that facts would show that there are many cases where an offspring has committed suicide as a result of what a parent has done. The mental, physical and sexual abuse by a parent is one scenario. Neglect is another. Blaming oneself for the divorce of the parents could also be a cause.

In the case at hand, the father was sometimes referred to as the "torture" judge by the MSM. There were many negative and hateful articles written which led to the conclusions that the Father was basically paid to render a favorable decision regarding the torturing of prisoners.
It is not an unrealistic reach to think that Jr. could have been under constant harassment and/or bullying by peers regarding his fathers "sins" and that may have led to mind set to check out.

The above is a big reach and very likely incorrect; however, since the OP offered absolutely no connection I thought I would give it a shot. Dooh!!
I mean, give it a try.

P.S. - I apologize if in my haste to get this to press I made any grammatical or punctuation errors.

 

[Turtle]

You can call it anything you want...again pointing out that YOU are person of authority in this little online world....

Yes, a person of authority which you attacked for no other reason than you wanted to attack me unprovoked, and you didn't like it when I responded in a manner which hurt your feelings.

Like I said, don't dish out it if you can't take it. Trying to get me in trouble with Lawrence ain't gonna work. Keep in mind I didn't attack you, disrupting the forums, I responded to your disruption. RLENT and I had a perfectly good "poke 'em in the eye with a stick" thing going on here and you flipped in and ruined it for one purpose, and even when you acknowledged your mistake on your own you still couldn't refrain from continuing to troll the attack.

If you want to see a person of authority in this little online world exercise that authority, keep on doing what you're doing, keep trolling, keep attacking, keep pounding it into the ground.