Please Discuss & Comment...
- Thread starter copdsux
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So what he is saying is one has to take away from the other? You cannot be a better christian and a better person at the same time? I guess with that reasoning if you work on your driving skills your going to be a lesser person. If you spend more time on fixing healthy meals your going to be a lesser person. Spend more time being a better parent your going to have worse people skills. I could go on and on. This persons logic is whacked!
greg334
Veteran Expediter
I think he is saying that devotion is JUST part of the thing between you and God and being a "Christian" - "But all too often "working on my relationship with God" has almost nothing to do with trying to become a more decent human being."
this is where I find many "Christians" just don't get the Jesus thing and act as if they are better than others.
this is where I find many "Christians" just don't get the Jesus thing and act as if they are better than others.
Lots of people act like they are better than others and have never set foot in a church. Being Christian has never meant being the perfect person, a misconception many folks have.
greg334
Veteran Expediter
True but I'm talking about those who claim to be "Christian" and make it a point that they are "Christian".
No matter what many believe there is some need to follow a specific doctrine laid out by some church and forget that it isn't about the church but the behavior of one's self that matters. God doesn't seen to require one to get close to him in order to be a better human but does require someone to follow his laws and simple rules.
God knows we will stray. what he asks is that we do our best to follow his "laws and simple rules" but when we fail to make amends for it and strive to do better next time.
The author is confusing 'getting close to God' and 'acting like a Christian'.
Acting like a Christian is simply that. I can go to church, sing the songs, wear the T-shirt, have a big ol cross around my neck, and plaster my car with bumper stickers.. but that has nothing to do with getting close to God. It has everything to do with trying to show a witness perhaps.
If I TRULY get "closer to God" I WILL become a better person. That's just the way it is. I must indeed 'work on my relationship with God'. Doing this WILL make me show His love to others, be more patient, kind, in short... a better person, a better representation of His love.
Doing all the things he says are "trying to get closer to God" will simply fill up my time. The only ways I truly get close to God are
1. Spend time talking to Him in prayer.
2. Spend time in His Word
3. Repeat.
Then I may do all those other things. I will go to church so I can praise God with others, in song and message. I will help others. I may put on the bumper stickers etc... but only as a RESULT of getting close to God...those things by themselves get me no closer.
And as for the Sunday crowd.. sad but true...
I've said it before.. God is Awesome... some of his P.R. Reps.. could use a little help.
Dale
Acting like a Christian is simply that. I can go to church, sing the songs, wear the T-shirt, have a big ol cross around my neck, and plaster my car with bumper stickers.. but that has nothing to do with getting close to God. It has everything to do with trying to show a witness perhaps.
If I TRULY get "closer to God" I WILL become a better person. That's just the way it is. I must indeed 'work on my relationship with God'. Doing this WILL make me show His love to others, be more patient, kind, in short... a better person, a better representation of His love.
Doing all the things he says are "trying to get closer to God" will simply fill up my time. The only ways I truly get close to God are
1. Spend time talking to Him in prayer.
2. Spend time in His Word
3. Repeat.
Then I may do all those other things. I will go to church so I can praise God with others, in song and message. I will help others. I may put on the bumper stickers etc... but only as a RESULT of getting close to God...those things by themselves get me no closer.
And as for the Sunday crowd.. sad but true...
I've said it before.. God is Awesome... some of his P.R. Reps.. could use a little help.
Dale
greg334
Veteran Expediter
Dale,
I respect your beliefs and your take on religion but I have issues with some of what is being said and being one who isn't defensive about my religion because it is between me and God, I find what the author is saying comes about to be more true more often than not.
I am not one who believes I need to get closer to God, I believe his mandate to me and others is to live as he wants us to live so I choose that path and stick to it of which when I made that commitment, I got as close to him as I could. I'm not perfect and do charitable things, I try to be considerate and take in account the impact I have on others but I don't demand others to follow me or tell others there is only one path to follow, God understands we are individuals and make our own way.
I also believe that the modernization of religion for the purpose of man is a determent to those who want to find that true meaning as he spoke of in the old testament and as Jesus spoke of in the new. Comparably speaking I find that religion has been tailored to man's changing environment and needs, not man changing for the word.
This is one of the themes I get from the Author, his position is what I've seen for years, and his list of 13 items seems to fit into the mold of those who scream about how Christian they are but seem to follow the same greed and selfishness - it is all about the person. The first five I would think is part of the mandate from God in any religion, be it Christian, Judaism or Muslim but the other eight are not and this is where I think the problem sits when I speak of greed and selfishness.
Many Christian mock the Muslims and even the Jews for following those first five steps, but fail to understand that it isn't about them and their religion, but respecting others. A common failure among the right leaning religious types epitomized with Santorum's ignorant comments about Islam in today's society.
Out of my collection of Bibles, I can turn to any one of them and I can't find things that people are talking about in those eight points - I don't find harry potter and don't see where I have to argue with anyone. I can't find where I need to attend a specific church or be saved (call me old fashioned but for those who came before me, especially before Gutenberg and the printing press didn't read the bible but practiced the same thing as I am practicing). So my point is that to me, the author seems to be speaking about not the truly devote, but those opportunist in the church. He isn't saying that the religion itself is bad but some who represent the religion as we accept them representing it.
I respect your beliefs and your take on religion but I have issues with some of what is being said and being one who isn't defensive about my religion because it is between me and God, I find what the author is saying comes about to be more true more often than not.
I am not one who believes I need to get closer to God, I believe his mandate to me and others is to live as he wants us to live so I choose that path and stick to it of which when I made that commitment, I got as close to him as I could. I'm not perfect and do charitable things, I try to be considerate and take in account the impact I have on others but I don't demand others to follow me or tell others there is only one path to follow, God understands we are individuals and make our own way.
I also believe that the modernization of religion for the purpose of man is a determent to those who want to find that true meaning as he spoke of in the old testament and as Jesus spoke of in the new. Comparably speaking I find that religion has been tailored to man's changing environment and needs, not man changing for the word.
This is one of the themes I get from the Author, his position is what I've seen for years, and his list of 13 items seems to fit into the mold of those who scream about how Christian they are but seem to follow the same greed and selfishness - it is all about the person. The first five I would think is part of the mandate from God in any religion, be it Christian, Judaism or Muslim but the other eight are not and this is where I think the problem sits when I speak of greed and selfishness.
Many Christian mock the Muslims and even the Jews for following those first five steps, but fail to understand that it isn't about them and their religion, but respecting others. A common failure among the right leaning religious types epitomized with Santorum's ignorant comments about Islam in today's society.
Out of my collection of Bibles, I can turn to any one of them and I can't find things that people are talking about in those eight points - I don't find harry potter and don't see where I have to argue with anyone. I can't find where I need to attend a specific church or be saved (call me old fashioned but for those who came before me, especially before Gutenberg and the printing press didn't read the bible but practiced the same thing as I am practicing). So my point is that to me, the author seems to be speaking about not the truly devote, but those opportunist in the church. He isn't saying that the religion itself is bad but some who represent the religion as we accept them representing it.