Phil's truck

greg334 · Jul 9, 2006

Congrats Phil (aka Ateam) on their new truck and the article, Looks nice.

Phil in all honestly I am really courious to learn a couple things.

I am wondering why a day cab and adding a sleeper to it? Wouldn't it been better to use an intergral sleeper and have the work done to lengthen it to your specs? The cost may have been less than you think. I seen a number of these done really well (being critical of body modifications myself) and even with Air ride suspension to give a smoother ride in the sleeper.

The other question is front axle wieght, is 11,620lbs cutting it really close? I thought that the state limit was generally 12K sometimes even higher, which I assume that if this is correct, putting a load on say 6000K will shift more than 400lbs to the front axle causing an over weight situation on the front axle? Please correct me if I am wrong.

highway star · Jul 9, 2006

That does seem to be cutting it close. But with a sleeper that big most of the weight will stay back on the tandems. It is a good looking truck. Best of luck A-team.

jaminjim · Jul 9, 2006

I agree, it looks like the tandems are near the front of the box, so little weight will go on the front axel.

Nice looking truck.

LDB · Jul 9, 2006

In the article it says it has the heavy duty front axle so there's a ton of leeway. It might cost a few minutes having the door plate looked at to show it's not overweight on the front but shouldn't be too much of a problem. As already mentioned, the tandems are practically even with the front edge of the box so there should never be a front weight problem. It's a very good looking truck. I'll be looking forward to seeing it on the road somewhere.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
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jaminjim · Jul 9, 2006

Even with the heavy duty front axel, I think that you run into the fed. limit but on page A15 of the Motor Carriers' road atlas '06 it says 34k for tandem drive axle, so why plate it for more than that?

Maybe I don't fully grasp the rule.

greg334 · Jul 9, 2006

Leo
I am wondering about the 12K front axle limit (I assume that is the general limit on the interstate)and the very slim margin of 400lbs. I mean that I thought that there is a 12K front axle limit regraudless if the axle is actually rated for 14K or not and that going beyond 12K is a violation.

From what I have been told by the engineers who actually design these trucks that a 6000K load will put more than 400lbs on the front axles where ever you put the load (assuming that Phil's statement of a c truck designed for a d load or something like that) and that Volvos are notroious for front axle overweight issues. I may be wrong about it and would like to know.

LDB · Jul 9, 2006

I talked to a guy with a Volvo t/t rig. He had something like a 144" custom sleeper on it with a 32" plasma tv covering the wall at the foot of his bed and four 17" tv's in the header above the seats. He had a satellite system and all kinds of switching equipment and could have a different sports event on every screen. He was something like 12,400 on the front axle. He said it was allowed because he had the heavy front axle and he also had oversize front tires that he said let him pass anytime. I don't know for sure and haven't looked into it since I don't have to worry about it. I really don't see how weight can be an issue with those axles set so far forward though because whatever weight is put in will be pushing down on the back not the front.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
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greg334 · Jul 9, 2006

Yea, I guess you may be right asking someone who drives a t/t. But here in Michigan we have a 700lb/sq in limit and the limit can be up to 15,700 except during frost restritions and then it is 10K. This means that secondary roads have seasonal restrictions.

See I don't know much about weight restrictions and how it really applies to larger truck on the road. I know that it has been proven over weight or even a small margin like 400Lbs on the steers may compromise safety and that when I asked about Volvos and read the reports, they mentioned center heavy and front heavy trucks not a recommended configuration.

rode2rouen · Jul 9, 2006

Greg,

The Rand-McNally Motor Carriers Atlas has a page dedicated to the allowable axle weights, listed state by state.

Only 8 of the 50 states allow over 34,000lbs on standard tandems. So A Team's truck has a usable GVW of 48,000lbs (assuming that the tires and wheels are capable of carrying the full 14,000lb rated front axle weight). With the jaw dropping MT weight of 32,520lbs, not including dolly legs, that leaves approximately 15,000lbs for freight.

Rex

Doggie Daddy · Jul 9, 2006

The one question i have is the size of the sleeper.The article stated that it is 13'(132")Must be that new math they are using.:7

LDB · Jul 9, 2006

I imagine it's an 11' or 132" sleeper. I looked at doing the same Volvo platform with a custom sleeper but couldn't get the dealer and vendors to work with me the way I wanted them to. It's certainly a beautiful truck. I'll be very interested in hearing how that chassis/engine/transmission performs.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
Highway Watch Participant, Truckerbuddy
EO Forum Moderator
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greg334 · Jul 9, 2006

>The Rand-McNally Motor Carriers Atlas has a page dedicated
>to the allowable axle weights, listed state by state.
>
>Only 8 of the 50 states allow over 34,000lbs on standard
>tandems. So A Team's truck has a usable GVW of 48,000lbs
>(assuming that the tires and wheels are capable of carrying
>the full 14,000lb rated front axle weight). With the jaw
>dropping MT weight of 32,520lbs, not including dolly legs,
>that leaves approximately 15,000lbs for freight.

Rex
I understand what your saying but here is what I am courious about - Phil stated that "a preliminary curb weight of 32,520 lbs. with 11,620 on the front axle and 20,900 on the rears." which I assume that axle rating does not matter when a state has a 12K limit (or X PSI) on the front axle unless permitted by special permit or what ever. I am asking Phil if my assumtions are correct or wrong that the 400lb (actually 380lb) margin is acceptable if say he has a 6000lb load and it shifts the balance to add more than 400lbs towards the front. I already heard from my freind at the MSP, which was intereting but I won't post her thoughts here.

Moot · Jul 9, 2006

Nice truck Ateam. I have wondered why you have waited so long to purchase your own truck. After reading the article I see why. A year to build this truck and the delay and cancelation of the original order. I guess that set you back at least 1 1/2 years.
Maybe over the next couple of months you could share with us some of the decisions and rationale behind the specing of this truck. I would be interested in why you chose Volvo? I know your last truck was a Western Star. Why a class 8? Have you ever run a 7. Is there much of a loss in fuel enconomy going with a twin screw? Do you see a loss in revenue with the "C" unit.
Leo, would you care to expand on the process of specing your truck? Would either of you do anything different?
If I ever bought a truck I also would go with a class 8 twin screw. I think the durability, warranties, and wider array of vendor components would be well worth the extra price.
I believe the 12,000# steer axle limit is more common among tractor/trailers. With a 34,000# pound limit on the tamdems that leaves 12,000# for the steer axle. If Ateam's steer axle is rated at 14,000# from the factory then the tires and all front end components should match the 14,000# specs and will be able to carry that weight legally as long as they don't go over the gross.
Once again, nice truck and I'm sure it was worth the wait.

davekc · Jul 9, 2006

Nice truck but as mentioned, it seems alittle heavy. It is configured simular to our KW and we have never had a problem with front weight. Ours is alittle lighter at 11,200. We can scale just under a 11,000 lb load before the front gets heavy (single axle). He has a fair amount of overhang like we do on the back.
The only thing I haven't figured out is what 7 or 11 "high level engineers" did? Secondly, I'm not sure why this was a secret for several years? It is essentially a stock setup from ARI.

Leo, ARI or ICT could have put one of these together for you. Is this the Volvo you were talking about?

Davekc
owner
21 years
PantherII
EO moderator

LDB · Jul 9, 2006

No, the truck I saw and visited with the owner had a walk in door on the driver's side about in front of where that second window is. he pulled his own trailer but I don't recall what type. His sleeper was a custom by AA in Texas. I was going to do an ARI sleeper on the Volvo but didn't get good followup from the Volvo dealer. After a few tries I gave up on using a Volvo chassis.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB, OOIDA 677319
Owner, Panther trucks 5507, 5508, 5509
Highway Watch Participant, Truckerbuddy
EO Forum Moderator
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Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

rode2rouen · Jul 9, 2006

>I understand what your saying but here is what I am courious
>about - Phil stated that "a preliminary curb weight of
>32,520 lbs. with 11,620 on the front axle and 20,900 on the
>rears." which I assume that axle rating does not matter when
>a state has a 12K limit (or X PSI) on the front axle unless
>permitted by special permit or what ever. I am asking Phil
>if my assumtions are correct or wrong that the 400lb
>(actually 380lb) margin is acceptable if say he has a 6000lb
>load and it shifts the balance to add more than 400lbs
>towards the front. I already heard from my freind at the
>MSP, which was intereting but I won't post her thoughts
>here.

Greg,

Most states will allow 20000lbs on the steer axle IF the truck has the proper components (axle, springs, wheels, tires, etc.)to support the weight. If A Team's has the wheels and tires to go along with the 14000lb axle rating, they have a 2380lb cushion. The truck looks like it will carry most of the load weight aft of the tandem centerline, so it shouldn't be to tough to keep it legit if load weight is in the "C" range. I think I'd be going to the scale regularly on the first month or so's worth of loads just to get a feel for how different load weights sit on the truck.

Rex

greg334 · Jul 9, 2006

Rex,

Thats the info I was looking for. Thanks

davekc · Jul 9, 2006

Not sure on the Volvos, but we had pretty good luck with Palmer when doing conversions. These were KW's. They do ICT, ARI, and Double Eagle.
The other thing I saw at MATTS was a company from MT doing a full intragal 120 on Petes and the KW2000. They had a truck outside in the show lot. Really cool.

Davekc
owner
21 years
PantherII
EO moderator

highway star · Jul 12, 2006

Dave, I'm with you on wondering about the secrecy and the engineers. The truck does'nt appear to be anything new. The big bunk, small box has been done many times before. Having been done before, it is odd that it was'nt done right the first time.

jaminjim · Jul 12, 2006

I have seen two of the Volvo 770 sleepers streched to somewhere around 10 to 11 feet. looked kind of neat. Must be some very good welders, because I could see no seam and no warp at all. But I did see them from across the Interstate.

Funny thing was I saw them just a few days apart and have not seen one again.