Michigan Police Download Cell Phone Data

blackpup

Veteran Expediter
I have been looking at this headline on Drudge. The Michigan State Police have a handheld device that can according to the article, will work on 3000 different types of cell phones and can even defeat password protections. The Michigan State Police have had these devices since before 2008. Wow shows how little I even suspect about computers, I would have thought breaking passwoord protection would have required a very sophisticated and powerful computer. Any one else know anything about this.

jimmy
 

EnglishLady

Veteran Expediter
I have been looking at this headline on Drudge. The Michigan State Police have a handheld device that can according to the article, will work on 3000 different types of cell phones and can even defeat password protections. The Michigan State Police have had these devices since before 2008. Wow shows how little I even suspect about computers, I would have thought breaking passwoord protection would have required a very sophisticated and powerful computer. Any one else know anything about this.

jimmy

And would that be legal without a warrant or whatever :confused:
 

Brisco

Expert Expediter
Post a link to whatever this is you're referring to.

I'm just kinda wondering if this falls under illegal "warrantless searches" protocol. Or maybe some kind of "invasion of privacy" statute. Won't know til I know what exactly this is.
 

blackpup

Veteran Expediter
Post a link to whatever this is you're referring to.

I'm just kinda wondering if this falls under illegal "warrantless searches" protocol. Or maybe some kind of "invasion of privacy" statute. Won't know til I know what exactly this is.

Sorry Brisco The link was posted on the Drudge report.

My computer abilities are strictly limited

EnglishLady
The ACLU has been trying to obtain copies of the files downloaded with no success.

Gonna have to work on my computer skills.

P.s. The original article was on thenewspaper.com website
jimmy
 
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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
OH NO! Not the ACLU. There are worst than the government. I trust them less than I would a molting rattle snake.
 

blackpup

Veteran Expediter
OH NO! Not the ACLU. There are worst than the government. I trust them less than I would a molting rattle snake.

Yeah the ACLU is full of lawyer types, but some of them do not seem to care very much for goverment overeach.

Yeah I knew that was gonna get me in trouble.
jimmy
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
OH NO! Not the ACLU. There are worst than the government. I trust them less than I would a molting rattle snake.
In this case you should be standig right there with the ACLU in outrage against Big Brother.
Mich. State Police confiscate cell data at traffic stops; won't say when or why | ITworld

ACLU: Michigan cops stealing drivers' phone data | Crave - CNET

Device lets police 'extract' motorists' cell phone data | WOAI.COM: San Antonio News

The biggest problem, at this point, is the Michigan State Police refuses to release any information at all on how they use the device. They simply don't want to talk about it, or even publicly acknowledge they have the devices or their policies in using them. They know full well that this is a Fourth Amendment issue, and that they have probably infringed on that Amendment, and they want it to quietly go away. Meanwhile, the ACLU has been trying for three years to get even a single scrap of paper under the FOI Act from the MSP.
 

EnglishLady

Veteran Expediter
In this case you should be standig right there with the ACLU in outrage against Big Brother.
Mich. State Police confiscate cell data at traffic stops; won't say when or why | ITworld

ACLU: Michigan cops stealing drivers' phone data | Crave - CNET

Device lets police 'extract' motorists' cell phone data | WOAI.COM: San Antonio News

The biggest problem, at this point, is the Michigan State Police refuses to release any information at all on how they use the device. They simply don't want to talk about it, or even publicly acknowledge they have the devices or their policies in using them. They know full well that this is a Fourth Amendment issue, and that they have probably infringed on that Amendment, and they want it to quietly go away. Meanwhile, the ACLU has been trying for three years to get even a single scrap of paper under the FOI Act from the MSP.



Why would they want to do this anyway? :confused:

I can understand if there was an accident and they wanted to see if the driver was texting or whatever .......
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
In this case you should be standig right there with the ACLU in outrage against Big Brother.
Mich. State Police confiscate cell data at traffic stops; won't say when or why | ITworld

ACLU: Michigan cops stealing drivers' phone data | Crave - CNET

Device lets police 'extract' motorists' cell phone data | WOAI.COM: San Antonio News

The biggest problem, at this point, is the Michigan State Police refuses to release any information at all on how they use the device. They simply don't want to talk about it, or even publicly acknowledge they have the devices or their policies in using them. They know full well that this is a Fourth Amendment issue, and that they have probably infringed on that Amendment, and they want it to quietly go away. Meanwhile, the ACLU has been trying for three years to get even a single scrap of paper under the FOI Act from the MSP.


Maybe so Turtle, I was not even aware of this one until today. I still don't trust the ACLU.
 

blackpup

Veteran Expediter
Any agency or organization has their own agenda. Their agenda may in be accord with yours for a while, but ultimately their own interest will be served first

jimmy
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
I heard this on the radio today...seems they have been doing it since 2008... 3 people called the talk show, each of them said the State Jack Boots used the pressure of "if you have nothing to hide, it isn't a problem"......:rolleyes:

This so illegal it stinks...:rolleyes:
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Why would they want to do this anyway? :confused:
Because they can. And so far because they can get away with it.


Maybe so Turtle, I was not even aware of this one until today. I still don't trust the ACLU.
The ACLU isn't always bad all of the time. Civil Liberties is an important thing, despite the fact that the ACLU will defend civil liberties even when what they are defending isn't popular, like prisoner's rights and the rights of those that most people don't like and would otherwise summarily revoke their rights, like when the ACLU defended a man in a NAMBLA case. But they defended Oliver North, for example, when his Fifth Amendment rights were violated by coerced testimony that resulted in his conviction. And they defended Frank Snepp (the CIA guy) when the government tried to enforce a gag order against him. The ACLU defends the separation of church and state, which many people find objectionable, even though the there is a separation of church and state in this country. But by the same token, they are defending Christian athletes who want to post the Ten Commandments on their lockers over the objections of the school.

The ACLU doesn't pick and choose their battles based on popularity, but rather choose them based on the Constitution. The ACLU is dead set against the Patriot Act, because it's unconstitutional. It's also against legislation that compels spammers to label their spam as spam, because standardized labeling is compelled speech, and as much as I hate spam, they're right.

3 people called the talk show, each of them said the State Jack Boots used the pressure of "if you have nothing to hide, it isn't a problem"......:rolleyes:
Which is really ironic, I think, since if the State Police has nothing to hide, then complying with a FOI request should be no problem at all. Right?

This so illegal it stinks...:rolleyes:
All I know is, they'll have to pry my cellphone from my cold, dead fingers. :D
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
I talked to my daughter, she is a low level exc with Verizon and she said they use that same exact machine to transfer everything in a customers phone to a new phone...including text messages and photos....

So these leo's can read everything that is in your phone...as with Turtle, thet=y won't get my phone at all....
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
"The ACLU doesn't pick and choose their battles based on popularity, but rather choose them based on the Constitution. The ACLU is dead set against the Patriot Act, because it's unconstitutional. It's also against legislation that compels spammers to label their spam as spam, because standardized labeling is compelled speech, and as much as I hate spam, they're right. "

Not sure I agree that they base ALL of their cases on the Constitution. I have NOT seen them fight ANY infringement of Second Amendment rights cases. (could be wrong, just don't remember them EVER doing it) Freedom of speech ALLOWS prayer in public, so does freedom of religion yet the ACLU FIGHTS prayer in school. Like NO prayer on the field prior to a game, or before classes start. That is NOT "making religion" that is only ALLOWING the practice there of.

I also remember calling them once YEARS ago just after I got out of the Army. I was having trouble finding work. Being denied work BECAUSE I was a veteran. I explained to the putz I was talking to what had happened. How I was NOT being allowed "equal opportunity" in the work place because I was a vet. His answer was something like GOOD!! We don't need baby killers working in our factories. Of course the ACLU LOVES killing babies. Kinda ironic since I never have killed a baby, or anyone else for that matter.
 

scottm4211

Veteran Expediter
Owner/Operator
I sat on I94 the other day while the michigan state police had one lane blocked so they could check out the contents of a tractor trailer they'd pulled over. Oh, and this was less than 100 yards from the entrance to a rest area.
Seems like some of them are on massive power trips.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Not sure I agree that they base ALL of their cases on the Constitution.
They do, though. They don't go looking for anything and everything that violates the Constitution and then defends it that way (there's only so many unconstitutional infringements that one organization can deal with <snort>) but if something gets brought to their attention or someone asks for their help, they'll help on Constitutional grounds, even when they don't agree with what's being done (like the NAMBLA and child pornography cases, and of course the Westboro Baptist Church, where the ACLU flatly stated that the Church should not be doing what they are doing, even though they have the right to do so).

I have NOT seen them fight ANY infringement of Second Amendment rights cases. (could be wrong, just don't remember them EVER doing it)
A famous 2006 case where a regional library district in Washington state blocked access to pro-gun Web sites (ostensibly to protect minors), and refused to remove the restrictions when a adult patrons of the library asked them to do so. The ACLU won that case and forced the library to remove the blocks on pro-gun sites.

But the ACLU's position on the Second Amendment is that of a collective right, rather than that of an individual right. That position is certainly a valid interpretation (which I, and I believe you, do not agree with), but it was based in no small part on the the Supreme Court's 1939 decision in United States v. Miller which reinforced the right to keep and bear arms as a collective right in the context of a well regulated militia. Of course, the Washing D.C. law that was struck down (D.C. v Heller) threw all that out the window and put it right back into an individual right. The ACLU still interprets it as a collective right. But they don't actually have a position on gun control itself. In their view, neither the possession of guns nor the regulation of guns raises a civil liberties issue. I think they're wrong, but they certainly have the right to interpret things that way.

But they aren't anti-gun or pro-gun control at all, which is what many people think they are. Just like they aren't anti-religion or anti-expression of religion, the way many people think they are. Just because they fight for the rights of an atheist doesn't mean they are anti-religion. What it really means is, when religious folks want to trample the civil liberties of those who think differently, the ACLU will defend the rights of the trampled.

Freedom of speech ALLOWS prayer in public, so does freedom of religion yet the ACLU FIGHTS prayer in school.
No, they don't. They fight school-sponsored or school-mandated prayer. Yes, like NO prayer on the field prior to a game, or before classes start, if a teacher or other member of authority representing the state is involved. Student-led organizations, those without school sponsorship, can pray all they want. But because the ACLU is against state-sponsored prayer, a lot of people translate that into the ACLU fighting prayer, in any form, in school, which is incorrect. There have been several cases (like the athlete posting the Ten Commandments on their lockers) where the school (or some other government entity) tried to prohibit an individual or individuals from practicing their religion on their own, and the ACLU intervened saying that the government can't sponsor a religion, nor can they disallow one, since there is to be a separation of church and state.

Personally, I don't see anything wrong with the state participating a religion, like a Manger scene at Christmas, as long as it doesn't allow Congress to pass a law establishing a particular one.

I also remember calling them once YEARS ago just after I got out of the Army. I was having trouble finding work. Being denied work BECAUSE I was a veteran. I explained to the putz I was talking to what had happened. How I was NOT being allowed "equal opportunity" in the work place because I was a vet. His answer was something like GOOD!! We don't need baby killers working in our factories. Of course the ACLU LOVES killing babies. Kinda ironic since I never have killed a baby, or anyone else for that matter.
I got nothing.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Yes, their Second Amendment position is that it is a collective right. NOT valid in my opinion. Why would 9 out of 10 Amendments be Rights that are those of the individual and only the Second be collective? As far as I know the Bill of rights are ALL individual rights.

They started off as an anti-war group during WWI.

We just believe different on the rest.
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Yeah, I agree with you on that one. The entire Constitution just screams the rights of the individual, not the collective right. It's a valid interpretation, I think, in the context of the well regulated militia, and I understand it, but I think it is an incorrect interpretation regardless, especially in the context of "shall not be infringed" which enables the citizen, both the individual and the collective, to protect itself from the government.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Yeah, I agree with you on that one. The entire Constitution just screams the rights of the individual, not the collective right. It's a valid interpretation, I think, in the context of the well regulated militia, and I understand it, but I think it is an incorrect interpretation regardless, especially in the context of "shall not be infringed" which enables the citizen, both the individual and the collective, to protect itself from the government.

I am under the impression that in U.S. code there is a section on the militia. Something about an organized and unorganized militia.

IF I remember correctly the unorganized militia was all males between the age of 18-45. They are REQUIRED to own a firearm and be able to produce it if called on to serve.

It has been a REALLY long time since I have looked at any of this.

Yes, the MAIN and most important reason for the Second Amendment IS defense against our government in the event it loses control and oversteps it's bounds.
 

blackpup

Veteran Expediter
I talked to my daughter, she is a low level exc with Verizon and she said they use that same exact machine to transfer everything in a customers phone to a new phone...including text messages and photos....

So these leo's can read everything that is in your phone...as with Turtle, thet=y won't get my phone at all....

chefdennis did your daughter say anything about the Verizon device being able to break password protection as the Michigan State Police device was thought to be capable of.

Thanks
jimmy
 
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