Mechanic's Warning!!

[ihamner]

Obviously I am not a mechanic - I still think it helps to beat on a battery with my shoe if the durn truck won't start! But, yesterday we got loaded and pulled over in the shade to wait for our departure. It was a HazMat load. When we finished with the details for departure our truck would not start! Grrrr! Beating on the batteries with my shoe would not work!

A mechanic came and worked on the truck. He found a problem with one of our fuel/water separators. He repaired it and we were on our way. But while he was diagnosing the problem he mentioned that in these new trucks (ours is a 2007 Freightliner) never, ever, under any circumstances let anyone spray ether into the air intake. This used to be a common fix to start a diesel engine. Here is the explanation I found about it: There is a big caution here however. Some engines have pre-combustion chambers and or glow-plugs. These and ether DON'T mix. So make sure it's correct procedure for your truck before using ether.

This mechanic said the ether would cause an ether lock on our engine and it could mean the engine had to be replaced!! He says if you ever see a mechanic heading to your truck with a can of ether tell him you do not want it! india

India Hamner
[font color="purple"] FEDEX [/font][font color="blue"]Custom Critical[/font]
D Unit
Wisdom is what's left after we've run out of personal opinions

 

[greg334]

"But while he was diagnosing the problem he mentioned that in these new trucks (ours is a 2007 Freightliner) never, ever, under any circumstances let anyone spray ether into the air intake."

Sorry no disrespect but Duh!

It goes for more engines than just the new ones. I know if I spray ether in my intake, the heating element in the intake will ignite the ether and I may end up replacing a manifold.

I would say the damage could be anything from a snapped connecting rod to a hole in the piston, seen both.

 

[ManLaw]

Thanks India for a heads up on something some people may not be aware of.

To Greg- that's exactly the kind of response that keeps some people from posting good information and some people from asking questions here at EO. Nobody wants to feel foolish. Your response makes SOME people feel that way. "No disrespect" or not!! Keep the "DUH" to yourself.

 

[D Team Brothers]

I appreciate the info, and from the point of certainly not being mechanical (some say I can barely drive) I can easily accept the "duh" and then take in the valuable info also provided. I try to learn something that improves me everyday. I welcome this info as the soon to be owner of a 08, thank you. Jack

 

[RichM]

I owned 2 old Mercedes Benz trucks, a 1986 Model 1117 and a 1991 Model 1319. These trucks had an automatic ether disbursement for starting based on the ambient temperature. When the temp was below 15,a small shot of ether would be put into the engine when it was cranked. There was a green light on the dash to tell you this was going on. It would only work in cold weather when the engine was cold. Using ether on a hot engine is a recipe for disaster.

 

[greg334]

Rich,
Some engines do have that system and others are never to be started with ether, ever. The owner's manual have the info, or you can call up a bonified dealer to get the info - many mechanics can not always tell you the correct info, like the one I ran into the other day who said my grease needed changing because it was blue.

But with that said, I have seen some rather dumb mistakes made by people who ignore the sticker on the engine/manifold or air cleaner - no ether means no ether.

As for my ‘Duh!’ comment, it was prefaced with "no disrespect" and I meant none at all, just pointing out the absurdities of the mistakes people make in trying to be the first on their block to blow up a 1500 lb piece of engineering marvel with a 12 ounce can of petroleum distilments which is actually a mixture of different chemicals better known as Benzine.

I don't say this often but my comments should not stop someone from posting anything that they think is pertinent to the membership at large and if India is insulted, my humblest apologize to her because of the harshness of the exclamation point, which was meant to be a factorial point and nothing else.

Just as a side bar, what the h*ll is a manlaw anyway? Is it like a throw back to some disco time or one of those things like mancow, – what ever that is?

 

[Doggie Daddy]

>Just as a side bar, what the h*ll is a manlaw anyway? Is it
>like a throw back to some disco time or one of those things
>like mancow, – what ever that is?


Sorry no disrespect but DUH!!

Don't you watch TV? The manlaw has been here for quite some time now and is a part of the American culture.

"Don't fruit the beer" Manlaw.DD.

 

[ihamner]

Hey Greg, I'm not offended. No problem. You have helped and advised me so many times on mechanical problems and your advice has been right on target every time. I appreciate your opinion and respect your experience. I always say to my husband, "Hmm, wonder what Greg would have to say about that."

Believe it or not, we did have an old timer (mechanic) spray a little ether in there the other day when we couldn't get started. Fortunately for us it didn't seem to cause a problem but the advice from this most recent guy made us realize we have to watch such things and that was the reason for my post.

India Hamner
[font color="purple"] FEDEX [/font][font color="blue"]Custom Critical[/font]
D Unit
Wisdom is what's left after we've run out of personal opinions

 

[ATeam]

A whole lot of mechanical disasters can be avoided if you take the time to read, understand, and comply with your operator's manual. If you are in a used truck and do not have the manual, it would be worth the effort to order one from a parts department or maybe buy one off eBay.

A good site to learn the basics is

http://www.howstuffworks.com/

 

[LDB]

Manlaw is a very stupid advertising campaign put on by one of the beer companies to attract a larger portion of the bubba segment of beer drinkers. My theory is the pool of bubba beer drinkers is much larger than the pool of intelligent beer drinkers so they go for a big increase from the large pool at the expense of some of the intelligent ones who will quit drinking their beer because they are repelled by the utter stupidity of the campaign.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB
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Owner, Panther trucks 5508, 5509, 5641
EO Forum Moderator
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[ATeam]

>Believe it or not, we did have an old timer (mechanic) spray
>a little ether in there the other day when we couldn't get
>started. Fortunately for us it didn't seem to cause a
>problem but the advice from this most recent guy made us
>realize we have to watch such things and that was the reason
>for my post.

That is a good example of experience doing potentially more harm than good. Old experience + new engine = potential disaster.

More than once, I have chased experienced welders away from my truck so I can disconnect all batteries and certain fuses before they begin work. These seasoned welders insisted that they have been welding for years and have "Never had a problem" welding on trucks without disconnecting the batteries first. They do not understand that a damaged semi-conductor may not fail immediately, but some time later, and long after you have driven away.

While they absolutely have years of experience, and while they are telling the truth about "never had a problem," their experience is your problem. Understanding the characteristics of semiconductors on modern-day trucks does not come from experience. It comes from a professional committment to study and keep one's knowledge current.

As I have often said, it is not the amount of experience that matters, it is the quality of it. That is true for mechanics, welders and truck drivers.

When faced with a conflict between a warning in an operator's manual and an experienced mechanic that discounts the warning, I will almost always go with the manual. If the mechanic cannot tell me exactly why the warning should be disregarded, the warning trumps the mechanic every time. In such cases, "I've been doing this for twenty years and have never had a problem." does not cut it.

And yes, I wear safety glasses when working on my truck batteries. As a former auto mechanic, I have worked on a lot of batteries and I have "never had a problem" with one blowing up in my face. Nevertheless, I heed the warnings. When it comes to things like blowing up batteries, blowing apart engines with ether, or blowing out a semi-conductor with a welder, how many times do you want it to happen; one in a hundred? one in a thousand? one in ten-thousand?

How often do you want to lose an eye? How often do you want to replace an engine? How often do you want to track down an intermitent electrical problem that degrades the performance of your truck?

I don't want any of those things to happen, EVER, so I heed the warnings in the operator's manual; even the ones that I do not understand or that seem superficial.

That sometimes making the harder choices. If on a cold winter day, a tow truck driver is willing to try a shot of ether before hooking you up to tow you in, it means telling him to put his ether away and tow the truck.

 

[Doggie Daddy]

You are so right LDB,that Manlaw thing is a blatant attempt to attract that segment of the population whose battle cry is "GIT R DONE" and think that the only king there ever was was Richard Petty.

I can see how the intelligent people who are probably sitting around drinking there Heineken and Samuel Adams from frosted pilsner glasses watching the sailboats pass by on the cape would be highly turned off by those commercials.

You probably find no humor in the GEICO caveman commercials either.DD.

 

[MikeC]

If you don't know your equipment and a inexperienced tow truck driver blows it up that is your problem.

But I agree with Rich, When my truck needds service I want the most experienced mechanic that is available to work on it,not some kid who just graduated Diesel School. A Team puts down experience but had he listened a few years ago his truck build would have not have had the problems that he experienced.

Another thing to watch out for are these self appointed consulants for this industry. Lots of horror stories have come out of the Ft Wayne area.

 

[ATeam]

>I think that if I needed surgery I would prefer a surgeon
>with 20 years of experience vs a guy just out of Medical
>School who has to refer to his Surgeons Guide of Good
>Practices just to find out what scalpel to use.

That over-simplifies things. For very good reasons, the value of experience being one of them, people just out of medical school are closely supervised by professionals with experience. Still, the newbie fresh out of medical school will be more aware of the latest technologies and techniques than the seasoned pro will be. In modern medicine, the latest technologies and techniques in the hands of newbies will save more lives than the twenty-year-old knowledge of the seasoned veteran. This supports the original point. It's not the amount of experience that a person has, it is the quality of it.

What would you rather have? A doctor with 30 years of experience that has not learned anything new since he or she left school, or a newbie freshly equipped with the latest and greatest?

The middle ground, of course, is the experienced professional who has invested ongoing time and effort into the continuing education required to keep up with the trade. In medicine, that is more important than it is in expediting; where after you have done one load you have learned everything you need to know to do nine more; and where after ten loads, there is not much more you need to know about hauling the freight to carve out a series of profitable weeks and months. How many times has it been said here? Expediting is not rocket science.

In our previous white collar professions, Diane and I both were required to complete a certain number of continuing education hours each year to keep our licences in force. A continuing education requirement for truck drivers would go a long way toward separating the wheat from the chaff and establishing the truck driving profession as just that - a profession - in the public eye.

 

[greg334]

Oh God! What a mess!

OK first things first.

DD, no I don’t watch a lot of TV, most of what I watch and enjoy is movies and news so beer commercials are limited to sports and that Saturday afternoon game shows, though I have found the Mexican shows originating out of Baja rather interesting I was warned about some of it being rather not for the whimpy US audience – I guess it is the differences in cultures.

As for Manlaw, I hope I didn’t chase them away, they seem to think that posting things negatively (or perceived as negatively) is a bad thing. I still don’t get the moniker and really don’t care unless they want to explain it in detail, I guess this is the drawback to my inability to function as a ‘normal’ human and watch ESPN or MTV.

As for mechanics, I find that it is like a marriage, you got to work on finding the right one to live with, other wise it is a nightmare and cost you a lot of money in the long run.

As for Phil’s comments, I sort of disagree with the Doctor analogy, because I have met a lot of new doctors who don’t have a clue when it comes to understanding common issues, or simple issues patients may have. I point to the Movie “Doc Hollywood†and the Coke Scene to illustrate my point.

The thing about being a professional, where have I heard that before? Well... never mind.

But also Phil brought up a very good point about welding and the stuff on board.

India, thanks for that note, it makes me feel a lot better.

And finally, I have used ether for a number of things, one was starting up an old Ford tractor that never had the glow plugs replaced and the head has to be removed to do that. The other is using it to get the head off of a flathead ford engine. For those who know what I am talking about, there sometimes is a problem with the gasket being bonded to the metal and no force gets it apart. Many times you can start the engine up and it pops it off but other times you can’t so out comes a can of Ether and BOOM, it is a part.

 

[Tennesseahawk]

DD... I totally agree about who the beer commercials are aimed at. However, I love the commercials for Milwaukee's Beast! Those giant cans are just killer! LOL Myself... I drink beer that I like, not what I see a tv commercial say is for manly men. More often than not, it's made with Made in China-like ingredients anyways. Lotsa beer - little money - quick liver death. I might have a 12 pack a year, so make mine an Amberbock or New Castle... or something dark and smooth. Quality, not quantity.

-Vampire Super Slooth Trucker!!!

 

[LDB]

DD, you are right. I don't see any true humor in the caveman can do it commercials. I understand them but they aren't funny. The one where the lady is going to make the car payment by phone as they are driving down the road and says "you know when I do something is going to happen". She does and then the rearview mirror falls off. That's kind of funny. The one where the kid is showing the parents his artwork he's going to put on sale at the garage sale that weekend and one is "mommy and daddy wrestling" is another funny one. The cavemen aren't funny though and the manlaw ads are just stupid.

Leo Bricker, 73's K5LDB
OOIDA Life Member 677319, JOIN NOW
Owner, Panther trucks 5508, 5509, 5641
EO Forum Moderator
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Support the entire Constitution, not just the parts you like.

 

[ATeam]

A Team
>puts down experience but had he listened a few years ago his
>truck build would have not have had the problems that he
>experienced.

Mike,

I was there. You were not. You have it exactly backwards.

Part of the reason our truck build project failed the first time around was that Diane and I vested too much authority and too many expectations in vendors that, combined, had a couple hundred years of experience between them. We believed in their experience. After all, they had built a lot more trucks than we have, and they all assured us they were up to the task.

Instead of us truck buying newbies taking a more hands-on approach, we laid out our general requirements for these experienced vendors and left it to them to do the rest. That was a HUGE mistake that resulted in them delivering the truck several months later than promised, and building a truck that was structurally unsound, illegal to drive, and unacceptable in several other respects.

This all developed not because of the lack of vendor experience, but because these experienced vendors took their eye off the ball. Just because someone has experience, it does not mean he or she will not blow it every now and then.

If the opposite were true, no experienced truck drivers would ever have at-fault accidents, no repair an experienced mechanic made would ever come back, and no rookie expediter would earn as much or more money than an experienced expediter with comparable in-service and availability numbers.

My point stands. It is not the amount of experience that matters, but the quality of it.

Want more proof? Consider the case of a twenty-year, highly-skilled mechanic who just learned his wife is sleeping with another man and the mechanic has taken to drink to dull the pain. How much is his experience worth to you when you pull into this half-drunk and mentally-preoccupied mechanic's bay?

Again, it is not the amount of experience that counts, but the quality of it. This mechanic's lifetime of great experience means nothing if he is not able to deliver it when you pop your hood.

Want still more proof? Stand at any fuel desk for less than thirty minutes and count the number of drivers lining up for emergency cash or $30 fuel purchases because, despite their many years on the road, they still do not have two nickles to rub together. If experience was all that mattered, only rookies would fail as truckers. If experience was all that mattered, something about putting ten years behind the wheel would translate into more than pocket change for life savings.

It's not the amount of experience that matters, but the quality of it.

 

[TeamCaffee]

TV - SUCKS

We have not had TV for at least ten years due to what is shown for commercials. You can change the channel and not watch the idiotic sitcoms but you cannot get away from the commercials. We prefer to filter out the garbage of the TV and get our news of the world other ways. We have XM, we have the internet and we also have access the news papers. Yes sometimes we feel as if we live in another world when people talk about the latest "dumb" commercial or who did who.
We found that we get a lot more done not being tied to the TV and we do not have those terrible graphic pictures in our minds that the newscasters just love to show you.

 

[pelicn]

I'm like Linda, the commercials irritate the heck out of me. While we were home for a few months, I tried to watch a movie on commercial TV and after the first 1/2 hour, it was 5 minutes of movie 7 minutes of commercials!!! I timed it because it irritated me so much, then turned it off.
We listen to XM, cruise the internet, read books and watch DVD's.

But, I do have to admit, the rear view mirror commercial is funny to me, because we had the exact same thing happen. x(