Maybe Another Try?

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
It will be interesting to see what this is all about. Another Nigerian man locked himself into an airliner bathroom prior to landing in Detroit. Same Flight that was attacked on Christmas Day. Stuff seems to be happening or this guy is a idiot to draw attention to himself 2 days after an attempted bombing.




DETROIT – A passenger onboard the same Northwest Airlines flight that was attacked on Christmas Day was taken into custody in Detroit on Sunday after becoming verbally disruptive upon landing, officials said.


A law enforcement official said the man was Nigerian and had locked himself in the airliner's bathroom. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because the investigation was ongoing.


Delta Air Lines spokeswoman Susan Elliott said crew members requested that security remove the man from Flight 253 after he became disruptive. The remaining 255 passengers got off safely, she said.


Airport spokesman Scott Wintner said it was the same flight on which a man tried to set off an explosive on Christmas Day.


"The pilot requested emergency assistance upon arrival," he said.


Security and airline personnel are on edge since the attempted terror attack on Christmas Day, and the law enforcement official said that lesser incidents had been reported on other flights arriving in Detroit, but the incident with the Nigerian man had sparked the most concern.
 

hdxpedx

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
Why not? Everyone is on a terror watch list,their own relatives are calling obumer's embassy's and all this group Care's about is PALIN'S blacked out baseball cap, health care payoff's, or CHENEY'S security attacks!! Ft. HOOD guy on a list, XMAS guy on a list, but any background check for us NAILED! Time for the secty notwortha**** to RESIGH!
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
It sure seems that our useless government is playing with everything to control our citizens and not doing the job that is required under our Constitution. They seem to be doing everything they can to circumvent or ignore our Constitution.
 

hdxpedx

Veteran Expediter
Fleet Owner
The theme song for this administration should be The NEEDLE and the DAMAGED DONE
 

Poorboy

Expert Expediter
Maybe they should List Obumma on the No Fly List as Well!! Take away his Airplane,Along with Michelles Personal Airplane!! As far as I am Concerned He's a Terrorist by what He's doing to this Country!! Drop his Sorry Butt Back Off in His Country of Citizenship (Kenya) and make sure he is never allowed to come Back to the United States again!! :mad:
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Could be Greg, could be. Obama proves me right more and more everyday!! He has no business in that job. He is not qualified for it, he does not have the proper attitude for it and, frankly, he does not support our Nation or our Constitution.
 

chefdennis

Veteran Expediter
Greg has it right, although this latest as proven to not be anythng at all...but yeap they practice going in incremental steps till they pull it off....and the Brits say there are over 20 more in the planning....


25 Brits in jet bomb plots

By ANTHONY FRANCE
Crime Reporter
and ALEX WEST

Published: Today
Cops fear 25 British-born Muslims are plotting to bomb Western airliners | The Sun |News

COPS fear that 25 British-born Muslims are plotting to bomb Western airliners.

The fanatics, in five groups, are now training at secret terror camps in Yemen.


It was there London-educated Umar Abdulmutallab, 23, prepared for his Christmas Day bid to blow up a US jet.


The British extremists in Yemen are in their early 20s and from Bradford, Luton and Leytonstone, East London.


They are due to return to the UK early in 2010 and will then await internet instructions from al-Qaeda on when to strike.


A Scotland Yard source said: "The great fear is Abdulmutallab is the first of many ready to attack planes and kill tens of thousands.


"We know there are four or five radicalised British Muslim cells in the Yemen.


"They are due back within months when they will be under constant surveillance."


The 25 suspects, of Pakistani and Somali descent, were radicalised in UK mosques.


Some had been to university and studied engineering or computer sciences.


Others were former street gang members.


Special Branch monitored them as they flew to Yemen, in the Middle East, from British airports in the spring and summer.


In almost every case, their tickets were paid for in cash and bought less than a week before travel.


The source added: "Imams would have promised them rewards in heaven for becoming suicide bombers prepared to kill Westerners."


PM Gordon Brown and Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir Paul Stephenson were being briefed.


The warnings came as another Nigerian was last night held in Detroit on the same flight attacked on Christmas Day. It later emerged the man had fallen ill.


Al-Qaeda in Yemen warned the West four days before Friday's attack that a bombing was imminent.


Terrorist Mohammed al-Kalwi issued the video threat in the wake of a Yemeni airstrike on a militant training camp.


Al-Kalwi was reportedly killed in another airstrike on Thursday.


President Barack Obama's administration is to review all airport security.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Why such an increase in activity? I thought Obama's "love in" with these disgusting people was going to end all of this? After all, it is the fault of the U.S. and the war monger, Bush. Obama has already apologized for our sins, could he have been wrong?
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
Why such an increase in activity?
LOL .... you think it is an increase ?

Of what exactly ?

I thought Obama's "love in" with these disgusting people was going to end all of this?
If anyone truly believed that, it would be de facto evidence of being stupid beyond belief ... further, it would indicate a total absence of understanding of what is actually driving the radicalization of Muslims.

Obama has already apologized for our sins, could he have been wrong?
He's absolutely wrong - since he is substantially continuing essentially the same mis-guided and self-defeating foreign policy in terms of the Islamic world as Bush, Clinton, the elder Bush, and many others before them.

After all, it is the fault of the U.S. and the war monger, Bush.
Well, the US is certainly culpable in the matter - but it isn't all Bush's fault (see above) - although Bush has certainly provided Bin Laden with plenty of material for further recruitment - think on that one for just a little bit ..... and while you are pondering it, consider this little fact:

The U.S. (Bin Laden and radical Islam's primary target) has a total population of around 300 million people and between 4% and 5% of the world's population.

The entire Islamic population world-wide is around 1.57 BILLION and is a little under 24% of the world's population.
 
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aristotle

Veteran Expediter
RLENT... I don't see this situation as being radical Islam versus the United States, but rather as Islam versus Western Civilization. This struggle transcends nation-states. It is one great ideology clashing with another.

Western Civilization is founded upon Judeo-Christian values, traditions and principles. All societies must embrace a core set of beliefs that give structure and cohesiveness. A commonly held set of beliefs is the glue holding civilizations together. Christianity experienced the Reformation and made great strides toward modernity. The Islamic faith has not moved to accept modernity. Their strict and literal adherence to the Koran leaves them in the Dark Ages, so to speak. If the Muslim fundamentalists cannot bring themselves to accept the modern world... modernity will overwhelm them. The radical Muslim clerics are keenly aware that modernity is the existential threat to their way of life. With the United States being the biggest kid on the Western block, the sulking clerics and imams send waves of jihadists to kick our shins.

For all its shortcomings, the United States does what it can to keep radicalism at bay. America has been and remains the greatest force for good the world has known. America's faults are dwarfed by her good deeds. She has no equal in the historical record. The apology tour sponsored by bedwetting liberals and delivered in person by Obama needs to stop.

Let's hope Islam and Western Civilization can co-exist. If the radical clerics keep pressing the issue and acquire nukes... there can be only one response. We win, they lose.
 

RLENT

Veteran Expediter
aristotle,

I can't reply in detail at the moment (got to sleep) other than to say: Your comments indicate a misunderstanding of the predicament we find ourselves in, and the true motivations of the enemy we face.

My advice: Read Michael Scheuer's three books - particularly his most recent (Marching Toward Hell: America and Islam After Iraq) - if you really want to understand the problem as it actually is (as opposed to the propaganda the elites - government, media, and religious - in both parties are selling .... and that you are repeating ;)) .... and what the solution is.

Keep in mind that while everything in it is based on open-source, non-classified material, the author, by virtue of his previous employment (Chief of the Bin Laden Issue Station in the CIA), has had access to a tremendous classified material which, no doubt, informs his analysis.

I will offer one additional quick comment however:

If the radical clerics keep pressing the issue and acquire nukes... there can be only one response. We win, they lose.
No, that is where you are entirely wrong - we won't "win" ... but we both certainly will lose.

That we will prevail in this war is not a foregone conclusion - it's ours to lose.
 
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Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
"Islam versus Western Civilization. This struggle transcends nation-states. It is one great ideology clashing with another."

Excellent. :)


Here's the thing... Several of the lead planners and top operatives in 9/11 were actually European Muslims, in addition to other parts of the globe, so Islamic extremists are not just limited to the Middle East, as we are now finally discovering. They're everywhere. They are large in number, but not nearly as large as many might think. ("Jim Jones, David Koresh and Meir Kahane do not typify Christianity and Judaism in the eyes of the civilized West, but those same eyes are prone to see Osama bin Laden and Mullah Muhammad Omar as typifying Islam," Richard Bulliet) Look at the recent news and arrests in the UK. Those extremists were all British citizens. We've had home grown American extremists thrown into the mix.

One thing that must be understood is that part of the reason for this large movement (relatively speaking) of extremism by some Muslims is due to humiliation. Many Islamic extremists are not just some poor, dumb people who are easily influenced. Many are highly educated children of privilege who suffer from damaged pride more than anything, and it's that damaged pride and humiliation that makes their mind malleable.

Islam teaches that it is the purest form of religion, the only right, correct and proper religion (of course, many religions teach the same thing) and Islamic extremists take this to heart and are convinced that Islam is the best, better than any other religion, ergo they must be better people. But when Muslims from the Middle East or European Muslims look at other parts of the world and other cultures, they see prosperity and growth. Prosperity and growth, for the individual and for society at large, is very much lacking in the Middle East. Spain for example (former crown jewl of the Islam empire), has a higher GDP than all of the Middle East combined. How is that for a slap in the face to Muslims who think they are supposed to be the greatest people there is? Just one small example, but it's things like this that lead to lashing out at other countries, other cultures, especially the West. Islam as a whole has been left behind in globalization. The Middle East overall has been lacking in the cultural and economic reforms needed to promote acceptance and tolerance, thus they are left to eat the dust of Europe and North America (granted, while we're all eating the dust of China).

Saudi Arabia is a prime example of a major Islamic state that has refused to do anything about promoting tolerance with other cultures, or any sort of reforms. People there live under a brutal royal family, which has managed to stay in power due to the one card they can hold over all others..... oil. They own it, they control it. The classic Golden Rule, in black. With control of their oil, no one is willing to dethrone them, therefor the royal family can do whatever it likes. Several of the 9/11 terrorists were Saudis, which shows a lack of reforms. Nigeria is another emerging example of zero reforms and tolerance for other cultures, not to mention a total lack of prosperity.

Some small Middle Eastern countries have turned things around and become more open to the world, like Bahrain and Du Bai. Not many terrorists coming from there. Bahrain was the first Middle East country to profit from their oil, and the first to run out of it. Once their oil was gone, they woke up and realized they had to reform because in order to survive in the world, both economically and culturally, their country had to tolerate other cultures and other societies so that business could prosper in other areas unrelated to oil.

European and Western Muslims also suffer humiliation, at least in the eyes of many Muslims. Wasn't too long ago that France banned the use of traditional Islamic headwear for women in schools. That kind of thing is an example of humiliation to Muslims. It would be different if the Jewboy Beanies were banned, too, but they're not. To many Muslims, they feel they are not respected or treated properly in Europe and elsewhere throughout the West.

Bin Laden and others, et al, are masters at manipulating these feelings of anger and humiliation and transforming it into something zealous, crazy, and very dangerous (Major Nadal, for example). They say that Islam is the chosen religion and that the West is poison and must die. What does Bin Laden and others, et al, want? He/they wants the world to go back to the 7th century, when Islam was in it's prime, with an empire going from Asia through North Africa, and was united, and at the time it was the worlds greatest empire. The extremist movement is both political and religious. What the radical leaders want is religious totalitarianism. In a sense, they are like Hitler, Mussolini, and Lenin, whereby they offer a message to those people who feel frustrated, angered and desperate. What Bin Laden and others, et al, preaches is Islamism in which the personal relationship with Allah is taken out of Islam and instead it is transformed into a religious ideology like fascism or communism. It is a system to give "justice" to those Muslims who are angry, and the leaders control. It is not a religion, because religion is meant to bring inner peace, not outer destruction.

Why don't you hear of too many terrorists from Asia? Well thats not to say there are none (because there are a few) but for the most part, Asian Muslims are much more stable than Middle East or European Muslims. Why? Take India, for example. Over 1 billion people, and over 400 million of them are Muslims. Yet why are there not many Indian Islamic terrorists? Because the society there has been much different compared to other Muslim communities. Muslims are not being left behind in economic prosperity in India. They have a chance there (albeit often in the guise of Bob of AT&T Customer Service), and with that chance they are not being humiliated, but being given hope and a chance to prosper.

From The World is Flat by Thomas Friedman:
"...when a Muslim grows up in India and he sees a man living in a big mansion high on a hill, he say, 'Father, one day, I will be that man.' And when a Muslim grows up in Pakistan and sees a man living in a big mansion high on a hill, he says, 'Father, one day I will kill that man.'"

It's a clash of cultures and ideologies.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
There has been an increase both in reported terrorist activity and in "chatter". Things have not yet reached the level just prior to 9/11 but it is building.
 

FIS53

Veteran Expediter
Part off what Aristotle said is quite applicable. Islam is a newer religion than Christianity. In fact it is 600 years behind. If you look at the history of Christianity and some other religions they all go through a change over time. This quite often means a more liberal take on the holy books words and a demand for more freedoms from strict religious control or oversight. The result for Christianity for example led to 100 years of religious turmoil and even religious wars (France alone had seven of them). Not only within the one religion and its new factions but also with other religions and religious groups.

Islam is at a point where many more under its influence are being better educated, earning more income and many are getting access to more information. This is cause for concern in the Islamic world as the people see and like some of what they see and want it. This means a liberalization of religious control is being demanded by the people and the religious leaders see their grip and control beginning to lessen. This happened 500-600 years ago in Europe with Christianity and the thousands who fled strict religious doctrines and control and now although a quite different world it is happening in the Islamic sphere. There are those who accept the changing world and changing religious attitudes and those who refuse to accept and let go of the past. These are the ones teaching that the west is the cause of all the problems in their society when in reality it is not.

The French clergy for years destroyed every single printing press they could find to keep control of the printed word under their thumb instead of embracing this new technology and leading with it. Ironically the first book published in large numbers was..... the holy bible.
Rob
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Reports this morning are saying that this lasted incident on that flight from Amsterdam was not terrorist related. The man involved was ill. The crew reacted properly.

Obama, however, is not!! He does not sound at all like a Commander in Chief of a Nation that is under attack. He should have said, before anything else, that the United States will not tolerate attacks on U.S. interests anywhere in the world and anyone that attempts to attack the United States will be dealt with swiftly and decisively. Then, in the background, review the proceedures for identifing those who should be on no-fly lists etc.

I don't know what else we can expect from this administration, after all, they are more likely to put combat veterans on a "watch list" than they are real terrorists. They are more likely to put a person who believes in following the Constitution than someone who is trying to kill our citizens.

Well King Putz the 1st, it is time to man up. At least try to act like a military Commander. It is time to lay off the stupid stuff, like taking over the Nations health care and another 1/5th of the economy and start fighting this war like it needs to be. If you not able to do that for any stupid reason, get out of office. You have no business in there.
 

FIS53

Veteran Expediter
While he does lack experience and has a short time as a politician (this really could be a good thing) he has come in during a rough time. You say he doesn't deserve to be there. Remember it was the people who voted for him who put him there. He ran on a platform of change of which he released few if any real details and how many changes he wanted to perform. That did not matter! Many voters in the country were tired of the old establishment in Washington and the State capitals and this grand idea of change was what they heard, saw and wanted! What better way to send a message to the establishment than by voting in a newcomer with this idea of change!

Most of us agree that some change in the way Washington works is required, as the way it has been was not conducive to good government and efficiency (I bet half of us could run some ops way better than the current system).

Yeah we see he has a lacking in many areas and also a very different attitude than the previous leaders, but this is probably something that is necessary in order to wake up some of the politicians and govt lackies into some action.

Is the way and what he is doing right? Did he have enough time to do things in a more acceptable manner and shall we say not forced? Probably not due to the system in place. So he opted for a fast and decisive move that angers millions and shows he is making changes and remember this was his platform - CHANGE.

Sorry but the voters who said yes to the new man on the block have got what they voted for.... change and it seems dramatic change.

I can't wait for the next major thing he decides to change or bill he is going to enact like amnesty for illegals or whatever. The US is in for a political wild ride.
Rob
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
All the malcontents voted for him. Change? What change? Just another inexperienced fool, just another leftist in a very long line of them going back as far as Wilson or longer. To have change in the United State we would have to vote in a true Conservative, something we have not had in that office in my lifetime!!
 

wimpy007

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
US Army
I got a notice on my web site that I won the Nigerian National Lotter for $2.6 mil and I sent all my info and $200.00 fee, maybe this guy was bringing my winnings:D:D:D LOL
 

Turtle

Administrator
Staff member
Retired Expediter
Taking a cue from LOS, perhaps we should amend the Constitution on the requirements for being President, namely, you must have acquired at least 3 Stars on your shoulder to be eligible for the office.
Uhm, <snort>


 
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