Kudos to Michelin

[TeamCaffee]

We run the Michelin Wide Base singles and after 380,000 miles we developed a bubble on the sidewall. We were in upper Minnesota and were lucky enough that we had several hours before we had to pick up our load. We called around to the local dealers and finally found a dealer that had one Michelin Wide Base single that was the XDN2 which has a horrible rolling resistance. We bought the tire as we needed to get our load. After we delivered we went looking for the XDA Energy tire and could not find one so we purchased another XDN2. We immediately saw a huge dip in our fuel mileage due to new tires and the tires we had purchased.

I contacted Michelin who immediately went to work to make this right. Two new XDA Energy tires were sent to a Ted Weins store here in Las Vegas and an appointment was made for us to switch out the tires. We are now the happy owners of two XDA Energy tires.

We want to thank Jeff Morris for his help on this situation. If you have any issues or questions send Jeff an email.
[email protected]

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Not tire related..

Linda/Bob...any thoughts about the wind skirting on a straight like what is now on trailers? to improve MPG's?

 

[bobcmo]

Yes we have talked about it but after talking to Freightliner engineers they are telling us it would not be cost effective unless we skirted the whole side front to back including the tires, which they do not do due to heat issues at the wheel ends. I would like to try it if we could solve the heat dissipation problem, I also am not sure we could afford to be the guinea pig for this test.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

am envisioning that some have their fuel tanks, boxes and apu's underneath and the a 10-12 feet open space till the rear axle...it's that open space where drag would occur as the wind whips around...

The heat you refer to would be from the engine I'd assume...trailers wouldn't be effected by this as there proximity from the engine...

I am also envisioning a 6 in. strip coming down from the box at the point the wind comes around with airtabs attached to defect this wind...

 

[greg334]

Actually OVM, there is a straight skirted and on the road. It's a class 8, using the original skirts on the truck and extending them to the tool boxes then to the drives. It is a 24 ft box and it is a nice looking job. The skirts are fiberglass sheets with a metal frame.

Freightliner guys bobcmo talked to seem to not include the fact that all bobcmo has to do is put the covers on the wheels and it solves the issue. There are a couple companies already doing that, something like the old Moon discs that was on my '50 ford.

 

[bobcmo]

The heat issue is from the brakes and diff.. Not allowing the heat from the engine to escape until it gets past the back of the truck seems to worry them, overheating the diff. and the brakes, this may not be an issue with disc brakes though or maybe if the wheel covers were vented to allow air in for cooling. I will note, when we put all the boxes under the box we did show a milage increase, small but it was noticed.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

Any reports on the effects yet? as in mpg's?

 

[OntarioVanMan]

The heat issue is from the brakes and diff.. Not allowing the heat from the engine to escape until it gets past the back of the truck seems to worry them, overheating the diff. and the brakes, this may not be an issue with disc brakes though or maybe if the wheel covers were vented to allow air in for cooling. I will note, when we put all the boxes under the box we did show a milage increase, small but it was noticed.

Small can be huge...even 1/8 of a mile per gallon would easily put 1,000 bucks back into your pocket...

 

[greg334]

The heat issue is from the brakes and diff.. Not allowing the heat from the engine to escape until it gets past the back of the truck seems to worry them, overheating the diff. and the brakes, this may not be an issue with disc brakes though or maybe if the wheel covers were vented to allow air in for cooling. I will note, when we put all the boxes under the box we did show a milage increase, small but it was noticed.

That wouldn't be the case by everything I have been told and read. The airflow under the truck still moves the air through the bottom of the truck which is not stagnate under the truck and a lot of the heat generated by the engine is transferred by the time it hits the end of the transmission. With nothing in the form of a d*m in the front of the truck or closing off the wheel areas, cool air still is abundant enough to cool things down. The skirting pushes a lot of the air that would becomes 'disturbed' without the skirting when the truck is moving - what I mean and maybe Turtle can chime in, that the truck creates airflow disturbances that actually pushes against the truck as it goes down the road.

I was listening to some XM trucking show a week or so ago and one comment made about aerodynamics made me think. It was that the KW Bull Nose COE got better mileage than a conventional tractor. I heard this before at GMC, the Astro got better mileage than the conventional, and think if the EU truckers are worried about mileage, then maybe they are right - COE trucks get better mileage even though it is a brick driving down the road.

OVM, yea I have a lot of info on their 'experiment'. They took it in stages and like Linda and Bob, they use SS on the truck. Overall the skirting added a little over .4 MPG increase over 6 months but there is more to the number. I have to see if I can get permission to post all of it.

 

[bobcmo]

It has been four years but I think it 2 tenths consistently. The boxes paid for themselves in fuel savings for sure.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

A little over .4 ? ...that is a huge number...it represents significant fuel savings...

 

[guido4475]

I was talking to a freind last night wondering how cost effective it would be to put a rubber skirt down the sides of a cargo van, similar to what International has on their new Prostar trucks,along with some kind of air dam in the front, below the bumper.

 

[greg334]

I don't know Guido. The question I think is how much clearance is there on the new International trucks with the skirting?

If it is something less than 4 inches, well maybe there could be a savings but then the question is what durameter (stiffness) would you need for the van to make it work?

Sorry Linda for hijacking the thread.

 

[guido4475]

Yea, I wondering the same thing in a way,but I see this stuff for sale in rolls in those high performance parts magazines.I figured a little flex wouldnt hurt to allow for rubbing a curb or whatever.The Internationals seem to have some flex to theirs as well, from what I can see.

 

[LDB]

I'm glad to see some companies are stand up and take care of their customers the right way, unlike Caterpillar who are scum of a company. I plan to switch to Michelins when it's time for new tires. Stories like this one are part of the reason why.

 

[OntarioVanMan]

I'm glad to see some companies are stand up and take care of their customers the right way, unlike Caterpillar who are scum of a company. I plan to switch to Michelins when it's time for new tires. Stories like this one are part of the reason why.

Darn them Frenchmen...*LOL*

 

[greg334]

But Leo, what did your lawyer say about the claim, isn't he pursuing it?

 

[ATeam]

We run the Michelin Wide Base singles and after 380,000 miles we developed a bubble on the sidewall. We were in upper Minnesota and were lucky enough that we had several hours before we had to pick up our load. We called around to the local dealers and finally found a dealer that had one Michelin Wide Base single that was the XDN2 which has a horrible rolling resistance. We bought the tire as we needed to get our load. After we delivered we went looking for the XDA Energy tire and could not find one so we purchased another XDN2. We immediately saw a huge dip in our fuel mileage due to new tires and the tires we had purchased.

I contacted Michelin who immediately went to work to make this right. Two new XDA Energy tires were sent to a Ted Weins store here in Las Vegas and an appointment was made for us to switch out the tires. We are now the happy owners of two XDA Energy tires....

Two observations based on your report:

1. Michelin Wide Base singles are not trouble-free (No one takes better care of their tires than the Caffees. This is not a driver neglect tire failure.)

2. Replacement super-single tires are not always available.

I like Michelin tires. We run them on our truck (duals, not super-singles). As the super-singles become more and more common and develop millions of miles of performance history, I trust they will loose their novelty luster and be seen as just another tire, that has its pros and cons.

Reasons we don't run them on our truck now include, availability, reliability (no better than the traditional tires we we run now), the cost of new tire chains that would be necessary if we switched to super-singles, and the lack of data that suggests fuel economy savings are sufficient on a straight truck to offset the above mentioned risks and costs.

Diane and I have not ruled super-singles out. We just don't see an immediate need or benefit to put them on. If there is good fuel-saving data out there regarding super-singles and straight trucks, and if it is positive, we might be more willing to consider the switch. I'd be interested in data people have to share.

 

[greg334]

Phil,
All you should have said is "we don't see the advantage".

Try taking a chance and buy a set to try out. I know they work, I know they don't have issues with getting tires to trucks, even sitting in the middle of Arizona as much as getting Bridgestones or Goodyears or what ever.

Try reading about the success and stop looking at trivial things, tire chains??

Pleeeze

There is a lot A LOT of data out there about the fuel savings these tires have, it seems that your research is flawed.

Get out of your comfort zone and take chances to improve your operation.

 

[Booker]

We have had Super-Singles on our truck for 3 years and availability has never been a problem. I ordered them right from the factory and they have been great tires. I see no reason not to have them.