Is the IRS a corrupt federal agency?

[Turtle]

I never worked with IP addresses, but I can picture them along the lines of an assigned radio freq, using them to ID targets in the same way. The packets I worked on were NOT on the internet.

It's evident you've never worked with IP packets, because there are never, ever any extra preambles or postambles with network data packets. The packet headers are always exactly the same length with the same number of bits. Decoding and analysing IP packets aren't cloak and dagger stuff, it's straight-up nerd-geek work.

 

[layoutshooter]

It's evident you've never worked with IP packets, because there are never, ever any extra preambles or postambles with network data packets. The packet headers are always exactly the same length with the same number of bits. Decoding and analysing IP packets aren't cloak and dagger stuff, it's straight-up nerd-geek work.

I never said I worked with IP packets, just packets and packet switchers. Most of what some would like to call "cloak and dagger" stuff, was straight-up nerd-geek work. The packets I worked with were also always the same length, for a given target, but not all targets used the same length packets, all had routing information, and a few "select" targets used some preambles and postambles. (This is very hard to discuss since much of this has yet to be declassified, but should be shortly, when it is you should read some of it, I think it would appeal to your "Nerd" side)

The packets I dealt with were often on stand alone signals. They were found in voice grade channels on TDM systems, inside spread spectrum signals, freq hoppers and even found them being used, likely as some kind of test, in an ionospheric sounder. Only seen it in that sounder a couple of times, why they were even trying that one I have no idea, but whatever it was, it must not have worked the way they wanted to work.

Communications analysis is always the same, only the source of the communications changes. By source I mean both tech and human. There is always external data to be gleaned. SOMETIMES one can get into the "internal" information As in all forms of "COMINT", which is what we are talking about right now. the more experience one has with the target, the better the analysis will be. I can imagine that the greatest difference between analyzing internet, and radio based communications, is that we had to mix in signals intelligence, "SIGINT", with the communications intell. That is, however, just my "best guess" since I never worked with the internet or the communications within.

 

[Pilgrim]

Nothing will come of this unless congress puts this in the Federal Courts.

From article:
First, Camp, and his colleague House Oversight Committee Chairman Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Ind.), need to immediately expand their subpoenas to every federal department, agency, or office that Lerner might have sent an email to or received one from, including the White House, which as we learned from U.S. v. Nixon is not immune to oversight.
Even if the IRS was not following the requirements of the Federal Records Act in maintaining email records, it would strain believability that every federal department, agency, and office Lerner emailed was similarly derelict in its duties. So, even if the missing Lerner emails are not on the IRS’s server, they may yet be located on other federal servers.
Second, time is of the essence. If there is a cover-up, it may take a court order to put a stop to it before it is too late. The House should immediately adopt a resolution directing the legislative body to file a civil action in the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia to enforce all outstanding Congressional subpoenas related to the IRS investigation, including any necessary forensic audits. The evidence needs to be preserved.


Read more at NetRightDaily.com: NetRight Daily» House must enforce Lerner email subpoenas in federal court

As stated in the above quote, "time is of the essence". The GOP needs to show come backbone on this issue and start playing hardball; taking the necessary means to put some people in jail - beginning with Lois Lerner who has been cited with contempt - would be a good start, followed by a few underlings who were directly involved with destroying these records. There will be a weak link somewhere, and one of them will talk rather than be stuck in the calaboose.

One other somewhat related thought: in the years to come, this is the agency we're going to trust with maintaining all our medical records.

 

[muttly]

More 'coincidences'...
IRS canceled e-mail back-up service ? weeks after Lerner hard drive crash « Hot Air

 

[Turtle]

Classified or not, it's extraordinarily easy to discuss. You want to talk about COMINT and SIGINT, and how "A GOOD traffic analyst can, however, determine much from the externals of a packet," in a conversation about recreating IRS e-mails from TCP/IP, SMAP and POP packet headers where no such 'packet externals' even exist. I'm simply not wiling to play a part in such a thread derailment.

 

[layoutshooter]

Classified or not, it's extraordinarily easy to discuss. You want to talk about COMINT and SIGINT, and how "A GOOD traffic analyst can, however, determine much from the externals of a packet," in a conversation about recreating IRS e-mails from TCP/IP, SMAP and POP packet headers where no such 'packet externals' even exist. I'm simply not wiling to play a part in such a thread derailment.

Sorry, I was just trying to talk a bit, nothing else was going on at the time. I was just trying to point out, never mind, it's just not worth it.

 

[Turtle]

As stated in the above quote, "time is of the essence". The GOP needs to show come backbone on this issue and start playing hardball; taking the necessary means to put some people in jail - beginning with Lois Lerner who has been cited with contempt - would be a good start, followed by a few underlings who were directly involved with destroying these records. There will be a weak link somewhere, and one of them will talk rather than be stuck in the calaboose.

What's really remarkable is the fact that people would rather get in trouble, up to and including prison time, for doing something wrong in destroying data, rather than allow that data to come out. Really makes you wonder how much worse, for them, the destroyed data might be.

 

[layoutshooter]

What's really remarkable is the fact that people would rather get in trouble, up to and including prison time, for doing something wrong in destroying data, rather than allow that data to come out. Really makes you wonder how much worse, for them, the destroyed data might be.

First off, they don't believe that they will get in trouble, because, they likely won't. Secondly, they don't believe that they are doing anything wrong, they believe that they are above the law. They also believe that it does not matter what it takes to accomplish what they are after since they believe their ideas are superior and that the end always justifies the means. They are that arrogant.

 

[Pilgrim]

The main problem is that we've got a Justice Dept and AG that's just as corrupt - if not more so - than the IRS. There was a special prosecutor appointed because of disclosures regarding the not-so-covert Plame bimbo, but pigs will fly before Eric Holder allows any special prosecutors to dig into any of the Obama administration's skulduggery. The Republicans are going to have to find a way to get IRS, Benghazi, and other stuff before a federal judge with the Justice Dept. actually working against them.

 

[Pilgrim]

More enlightenment regarding the IRS/Obama corruption; if this is typical of the emails that can't be found, it's easy to see why they were "lost". In addition, the public in general probably didn't realize the continual bashing of conservative financial support groups that was being done by Obama as a result of the Citizens United decision that was so publicly criticized. But when summarized in this article in light of everything else that's been done recently by the IRS, the picture of corruption and coverup comes into focus very nicely.

An email recently released by the House Oversight Committee shows IRS official Sarah Ingram was pretty excited about President Obama publicly speaking out against conservative groups with "secret donors." The email was sent from Ingram to Lois Lerner and others inside the tax agency after a glowing piece was published in the New York Times about the IRS and the trouble it was having with new tax exempt applicants and groups in light of the 2010 Citizen's United ruling...

Was the White House involved in the IRS's targeting of conservatives? No investigation needed to answer that one. Of course it was.

Mr. Obama didn't need to pick up the phone. All he needed to do was exactly what he did do, in full view, for three years: Publicly suggest that conservative political groups were engaged in nefarious deeds; publicly call out by name political opponents whom he'd like to see harassed; and publicly have his party pressure the IRS to take action.

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2014/06/23/emails-show-irs-officials-were-pretty-happy-about-obama-publicly-singling-out-conservative-groups-n1849951?utm_source=thdailypm&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl_pm

Going back to the corruption of the IRS and the Justice Dept, here's something else to add to the recipe of this mess that's becoming more Nixonian every passing day. Those of us who are old enough to remember Watergate also remember how John Mitchell handled his duties as Nixon's AG and what happened to him as a result.

On February 21, 1975, Mitchell was found guilty of conspiracy, obstruction of justice, and perjury and sentenced to two and a half to eight years in prison for his role in the Watergate break-in and cover-up, which he dubbed the "White House horrors". ...
Tape recordings made by President Nixon and the testimony of others involved confirmed that Mitchell had participated in meetings to plan the break-in of the Democratic Party's national headquarters in the Watergate Hotel.[SUP][citation needed][/SUP] In addition, he had met, on at least three occasions, with the president in an effort to cover up White House involvement after the burglars were discovered and arrested.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_N._Mitchell

For a long time it appeared that these crooks were going to get off without a scratch because they thought they were above the law, and had the right connections and political cronies in the right places to protect them. Then during the Senate hearings an anonymous character named Alexander Butterfield mentioned something about the tapes that Nixon kept. Maybe there's an "Alexander Butterfield" somewhere in the bowels of the Obama White House or the IRS, or even another "Deep Throat".

Chances are Eric Holder, Lois Lerner and a few others could easily be convicted of the same offenses as Mitchell if there are a few honest Republicans and Democrats that have the tenacity to go after them with the necessary ruthlessness to uncover the facts.

 

[layoutshooter]

The press HATED Nixon and would do just about ANYTHING to get rid of him. Obama can do no wrong in the eyes of the press, and even if he does something illegal, or unconstitutional, it's OK, it is for the greater good, whether anyone else can see that or likes it.

 

[muttly]

As I said before, some say Nixon should have burned all the tapes . Look what happened to John Mitchell: HE WENT TO JAIL.The tapes were the 'smoking gun' evidence.He probably wished someone would have destroyed them. The tapes helped him get convicted. That is why I believe Lerner's emails were destroyed. Destroy the evidence and the ability to prove the crime becomes much more difficult. You can have all the coincidental and circumstantial evidence there is, (e-mails destroyed 10 days after investigation starts.record backup company dismissed weeks after computer crash, to name two examples)and it won't matter as far as punishing wrongdoing. The wrongdoers will just say 'stuff happens'.

 

[layoutshooter]

"The wrongdoers will just say 'stuff happens'."

And many will fall for it.

 

[Jamin_Joe]

Data backup facts.

From 1987 to 2002 I have worked with backups and disaster recovery, even was team leader of a data center move.

1. It is impossible to recover data from only incremental pckups since they only backup files that have been modified from the last backup. These are referred to as daily backup sets.

2. It has been an acceptable standard to perform a full backup every week and in the insurance and hospital that I worked at these had long retention dates due to law. Most were 5 to 20 years depending on what databases were contained on the servers.

3. Countless times, I recovered documents from full backups, which are the same backups used for disaster recovery. It is much easier to use those than dealing with the incremental ones.
The software that is used for backups handles both incremental and full backups. The procedure is to insert the last tape to view the index and highlight the directory, disk, or file to be restored and select where to copy it to. It is that simple, the compression, encription is an automatic function and the security functions are based on userids and additional passwords if necessary.

That is about it.

 

[WanderngFool]

The press HATED Nixon and would do just about ANYTHING to get rid of him. Obama can do no wrong in the eyes of the press, and even if he does something illegal, or unconstitutional, it's OK, it is for the greater good, whether anyone else can see that or likes it.

Dude. Nixon was downed by the press? No sir, Nixon was downed by the evil that was Nixon.

You and I are about the same age. Do you remember the posters that were so popular back then? A pic of Nixon with the caption "Would you buy a used car from this man?". And that was years before Watergate!!!

Somehow people sized up the man and knew that bad things were about to happen. It was in his DNA. The press simply did their jobs and reported it after the stuff hit the fan.

 

[layoutshooter]

Dude. Nixon was downed by the press? No sir, Nixon was downed by the evil that was Nixon.

You and I are about the same age. Do you remember the posters that were so popular back then? A pic of Nixon with the caption "Would you buy a used car from this man?". And that was years before Watergate!!!

Somehow people sized up the man and knew that bad things were about to happen. It was in his DNA. The press simply did their jobs and reported it.

I did not say that it was the press that downed him, I said that they hated him and would have done whatever they could to help the process.

Obama has even LOWER ratings, is stepping all OVER the Constitution and the press is kissing his donkey behind.

Actually, I did not pay that much attention to Nixon. I was more concerned on when I was going to be drafted and what I could do about it. Who was president, at that time, would have little bearing on that.

I agree, Nixon was one evil dude, I believe Obama is worse. I would not buy a glass of water from him if I was dying of thirst.

As I have always said, I have NEVER liked ANY president in my adult, voting age life, and unless there is a revolt, I likely never will.

 

[zorry]

With Obamacare dying of thirst should be the least of your concerns.

 

[aristotle]

More enlightenment regarding the IRS/Obama corruption; if this is typical of the emails that can't be found, it's easy to see why they were "lost". In addition, the public in general probably didn't realize the continual bashing of conservative financial support groups that was being done by Obama as a result of the Citizens United decision that was so publicly criticized. But when summarized in this article in light of everything else that's been done recently by the IRS, the picture of corruption and coverup comes into focus very nicely.

Going back to the corruption of the IRS and the Justice Dept, here's something else to add to the recipe of this mess that's becoming more Nixonian every passing day. Those of us who are old enough to remember Watergate also remember how John Mitchell handled his duties as Nixon's AG and what happened to him as a result.

For a long time it appeared that these crooks were going to get off without a scratch because they thought they were above the law, and had the right connections and political cronies in the right places to protect them. Then during the Senate hearings an anonymous character named Alexander Butterfield mentioned something about the tapes that Nixon kept. Maybe there's an "Alexander Butterfield" somewhere in the bowels of the Obama White House or the IRS, or even another "Deep Throat".

Chances are Eric Holder, Lois Lerner and a few others could easily be convicted of the same offenses as Mitchell if there are a few honest Republicans and Democrats that have the tenacity to go after them with the necessary ruthlessness to uncover the facts.

What we lack today are statesmen; men and women in public office who place the principle of good government ahead of party affiliation. During the Watergate era, we had statemen such as Senator Howard Baker(Republican) who asked the famous question, "What did the President know? And when did he know it?" Moreover, we had statemen like Republican Senator Barry Goldwater who made the trip to the White House telling Nixon resignation from office was best.

Other than Senator Diane Feinstein's recent aggravation with the White House for failing to inform her committee as required about the release of 5 Gitmo detainees, no high ranking Democrat seems willing to hold Obama or his lieutenants accountable when questionable activity takes place. We need more officeholders who will place country before party.

 

[Jamin_Joe]

Of course on thing that needs to be considered is that there is at least one person who has the emails they got printed out and hidden to be used in their defense. Like magic, it will strangly appear when they are in danger of being proscecuted.

 

[redytrk]

Why not just use the NSA copy?