Explain Please

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Can some one please explain why this has NOT been splattered all over the news since this happened? There has been little mention on ANY broadcast news. Can you imagine if this had been gangs of "skinheads" attacking black people? No bias here. :mad:

I was wondering what I would do IF a mob ever attacked my truck in this manner. No gun for protection but I DO have an ACCELERATOR under my right foot and this truck weighs 30,000lbs empty.









(WI) State Fair melees produce 11 injuries, 31 arrests​


Unprecedented violence on the opening night of the Wisconsin State Fair by rampaging youths prompted extraordinary measures Friday: The head of the fair implemented new rules to keep unattended teens off the grounds at night, and Gov. Scott Walker ordered the State Patrol to help keep order.

Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett and Police Chief Ed Flynn, meanwhile, promised Friday to beef up policing at this weekend's major public events around the city to limit any chance of the State Fair events being repeated.

The violence left workers and patrons of the fair in West Allis shaken and reminded many of the mob-like disturbances that occurred over the Fourth of July weekend in Milwaukee.

The trouble at the fair started around 7 p.m. Thursday in the midway area, where amusement rides are located, when fights broke out among black youths, said Tom Struebing, chief of the State Fair Police. Those fights did not appear to be racially motivated.

Then around the closing time of 11 p.m., witnesses told the Journal Sentinel, dozens to hundreds of black youths attacked white people as they left the fair, punching and kicking people and shaking and pounding on their vehicles.

At least 31 people were arrested - many for disorderly conduct - in connection with the incidents on the fairgrounds and on the streets outside. At least 11 people, seven of them police officers, were injured, officials said. Twenty-four people were arrested within the fairgrounds by State Fair Police. West Allis police arrested seven people, five of them juveniles, outside the fairgrounds.

Struebing said two injured officers were hospitalized; one was hit in the face with an improvised weapon, the other suffered a concussion.

"We normally can handle anything in the park," Struebing said.

Because of the violence, Rick Frenette, CEO of the fair, announced that the fair would immediately implement a policy in which no youths under 18 years of age would be allowed onto the grounds after 5 p.m. without a parent or guardian at least 21 years old.

Frenette, a veteran of 40 years in fair management, said he had never implemented such a policy before.

Walker made the decision to provide extra State Patrol help after reviewing the incidents, said his spokesmen, Cullen Werwie.

"We will continue to evaluate the situation and make any adjustments necessary to ensure a successful and safe event. We will be doing everything in our power to ensure that parents feel that it is safe to bring their children to the world's best fair," Werwie said in a statement.

West Allis Mayor Dan Devine said in a statement that "thuggery has no place at the Wisconsin State Fair, or anywhere in our society."

Devine said he was disgusted by the reports of violence. "It is appalling that a group of hoodlums has cast such a negative light on what is traditionally a safe and family friendly event," he said in a statement.

Barrett said there would be no tolerance for violence at festivals and that perpetrators will be prosecuted - regardless of race.

"Two years ago, I was a victim of a random attack (outside) State Fair . . . last night, events took place at State Fair that I don't believe are random," Barrett said at a City Hall news conference. The attack by a man wielding a tire iron left Barrett with stitches in his head, broken teeth and broken bones in his right hand. On Friday, security started setting up extra metal fencing at entrances around 5 p.m.

Patrice Harris, communications manager for the State Fair, said identification will be checked at each gate in the area where bags are searched. She said the time spent checking for identification shouldn't affect the time spent waiting in line before getting into the fair.

At Gate 3, at least 70 people had their IDs checked within the first hour. All appeared to be minors without guardians.

Jeremy Chavez, Anthony Henderson and Anthony DeHoyas, all 16, were among those stopped.

"I didn't know about the adult thing," Chavez said, although he had heard that IDs would be checked. Henderson and DeHoyas were also taken by surprise.

DeHoyas, who was celebrating his birthday Friday, was upset at being turned away and said he doesn't plan to come back.

He called his mother, who came to the fair to supervise the three teenagers.

Police from three jurisdictions - West Allis, Milwaukee and Wisconsin State Fair - spent Friday trying to piece together what happened. But they could not say what started the situation.

Witnesses, though, told the Journal Sentinel that the attacks appeared to be unprovoked and racially motivated.

"You could just tell they were after white people. That was the main thing. If you were white, they were coming after you," said Jon Stikl of Oak Creek.

He said he was stuck in traffic as a group of young people blocked cars near the fair gate on S. 84th St. near I-94 after he picked up family members attending the fair.

"We noticed a group of five to 10 young black males run up and jump a young white male for no other reason then him being white," Stikl said.

They knocked him to the ground, and then a group of 15 black men kicked and stomped on him, Stikl said.

"My wife's brother jumped out of the car - his natural reaction was to try to break it up. Before you knew it, five or 10 guys were on him and started punching at him. My wife was able to pull him back in the car. So now they surrounded my car and just started punching through the windows, kicking and shaking the car, screaming racial things."

He said there should have been more police presence, given that disturbances were reported inside the fairgrounds shortly after 7 p.m. Thursday.

"I was disgusted by the lack of security. It's a black eye on the State Fair" and police, he said.

Andrew J. Coleman, a recent University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee graduate, said he and a friend were attacked about 10:30 p.m. after they left the fair through the gate off S. 84th near the Pettit National Ice Center.

"I just heard footsteps behind me and I turned around and I got hit in the face. There were six or seven just beating on me," said Coleman, who has a sore jaw from the punches.

His friend was stomped on and his sneakers stolen, said Coleman, of Milwaukee.

A concession worker who works near the midway area told the Journal Sentinel that earlier Thursday night, large groups of African-American youths ran through the midway, knocking over young children and adults, disrupting midway amusement rides and tearing signs up. The midway is east of the Pettit National Ice Center and adjacent to the Hank Aaron State Trail.

"I have never seen anything like it," the worker said. "It was mob mentality."

The worker said there was police presence, including officers on horseback, but it was not enough.

A 34-year-old Muskego man said he was riding on the Ferris wheel in the midway with one of his children when he heard shouts of "fight" sometime after 7 p.m. He saw a big group of people, perhaps 200 to 300, gathered around a brawl.

"I've never seen anything like this in my life. . . . There were so many people you couldn't see who was fighting. There was just this big group that kept growing and chanting, 'Fight, fight, fight,' " he said. "That lasted for one to two minutes. Then when security showed up blowing some whistles, all of this mob started running. It was like a herd of cattle."

Milwaukee Common Council President Willie Hines said he was at the fair Thursday night and witnessed blacks fighting each other, but did not see any blacks attack whites.

He said that if it happened, those individuals should be charged with the crime as well as a hate crime.

"They should be penalized for the prime incident, and we should have a racial enhancer," Hines said.

Although some fairgoers were critical of police response, Hines said State Fair police acted appropriately and professionally.

"They were working hard to control the chaos," Hines said.

He said some coordination problems with other police departments might have happened outside the grounds.

The Wisconsin State Fair is in different jurisdictions. The north side of the fairgrounds, from the Hank Aaron State Trail north, is in Milwaukee. The rest is in West Allis. Adding to the confusion is that the Wisconsin State Fair Park police have jurisdiction only on the fairgrounds, not outside of it.

The incidents Thursday night come as the State Fair Board has worked to increase diversity at the annual fair, expanding its entertainment lineup and attempting to appeal to a younger, more multicultural audience. Diversity was a priority for former State Fair Park Chairman Martin Greenberg, who spoke of making it a "place of inclusion, not exclusion."

The violence is similar to what occurred in Milwaukee's Riverwest neighborhood over the July 4 holiday, when about 60 young people beat and robbed a smaller group that had been watching fireworks from Kilbourn Reservoir Park. The injured people were white; the attackers were African-American, witnesses said. Another group looted a convenience store.

Thursday night's Main Stage performer was rapper MC Hammer, but a number of people who attended the concert said the show wasn't to blame for the disturbances at the fair. One woman said the crowd watching Hammer was mostly white and adult, and any children there seemed to be with parents.

Another woman said the concert was "very laid-back and had no craziness that we witnessed at all. The craziness was in the midway."











State Fair melees produce 11 injuries, 31 arrests - JSOnline
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
The simple solution is racial profiling, make the policy if you are black and under 18 you are not entering. The attacks were not age motivated, they were racially motivated so why not address the true issue. I would expect the exact same thing if it were another race and I would be willing to venture a guess that if it were whites targeting blacks there would be a much bigger outcry and you can be sure Jackson and Sharpton would be there starting a media circus. The problem is that you can't be a champion of the white victims without being labeled a white supremacist. This is why we need county vigilantes, the police are overwhelmed so you call in these people to pose as victims and they have the option to shoot or detain offenders. It is a brutal form of justice that should be run by the people which will help stop crime in emergency situations like this or people of the local municipality can vote to bring them in if they feel crime is out of control.

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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
The thugs that were involved with this are nothing more than racist terrorists. I just do NOT understand why they are not be called out as such? What possible reason is there do condone or ignore this?
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
The thugs that were involved with this are nothing more than racist terrorists. I just do NOT understand why they are not be called out as such? What possible reason is there do condone or ignore this?

I think there are some fears that if you make these people responsible for what they have done it will invite riots to take place. It would also garner attention from Jackson and Sharpton so that they show up and explain how these poor people aren't responsible for what they have done which then end up costing taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars in protection and long drawn out court battles.

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Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
LOS... haven't we used that word terrorist way too much for something it wasn't meant for? They were brutes, thugs, bullies, criminals, savages, whatever. But I doubt very much they were terrorists.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
Can you imagine the outcry, the horror, IF, someone had either defended themselves or another with a firearm? Holy Bubblegum BatMan!!!!!! :eek: Lawsuits, riots, name calling and public castration!! They would BLAME the person who was defending themselves and/or others and call for more gun control and riots.
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
Can you imagine the outcry, the horror, IF, someone had either defended themselves or another with a firearm? Holy Bubblegum BatMan!!!!!! :eek: Lawsuits, riots, name calling and public castration!! They would BLAME the person who was defending themselves and/or others and call for more gun control and riots.

There are a lot of states that defend criminals better than victims. When you empower the people with a strong Castle Doctrine they still have the ability to run if they chose but there is also the ability for them to confront the criminal and make the world a better place.


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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
LOS... haven't we used that word terrorist way too much for something it wasn't meant for? They were brutes, thugs, bullies, criminals, savages, whatever. But I doubt very much they were terrorists.

MMM, If "I" were being threatened or attacked by a mob I would be
"terrorized" by them. Is that not what the word means? Is there ONLY one meaning?


ter·ror·izedter·ror·iz·ing

Definition of TERRORIZE

transitive verb
1
: to fill with terror or anxiety : scare
2
: to coerce by threat or violence

Makes them terrorists in my book.
 

Tennesseahawk

Veteran Expediter
MMM, If "I" were being threatened or attacked by a mob I would be
"terrorized" by them. Is that not what the word means? Is there ONLY one meaning?


ter·ror·izedter·ror·iz·ing

Definition of TERRORIZE

transitive verb
1
: to fill with terror or anxiety : scare
2
: to coerce by threat or violence

Makes them terrorists in my book.

I know. But you're playing the liberal's game of calling everyone they don't agree with a terrorist. Truly, it's gotten overused; and doesn't carry much weight anymore. Basically, people use it when they want the shock of their statement to resonate, whether or not the person is a terrorist.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
I know. But you're playing the liberal's game of calling everyone they don't agree with a terrorist. Truly, it's gotten overused; and doesn't carry much weight anymore. Basically, people use it when they want the shock of their statement to resonate, whether or not the person is a terrorist.


People who terrorize other ARE terrorists. Just because others want to "over use" or "misuse" the word is no reason to not use it when it needs to be. This crowd of thugs did this to harm and cause terror. Those who were attacked were terrorized by their actions.

It is just too bad that there was no one there willing to stand up and put an end to the actions of these horrible people. Just another example of why THIS granddad often carries his .357. I most surely would have used it.
 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
MMM, If "I" were being threatened or attacked by a mob I would be
"terrorized" by them. Is that not what the word means? Is there ONLY one meaning?


ter·ror·izedter·ror·iz·ing

Definition of TERRORIZE

transitive verb
1
: to fill with terror or anxiety : scare
2
: to coerce by threat or violence

Makes them terrorists in my book.
I was going to criticize your statement based on the difference between "terrorize" and "terrorism," which, while similar, aren't exactly the same, though they come from the same transitive verb.

But then I looked up the definition of terrorism, one of which, according to wikipedia, is this:
"Criminal acts intended or calculated to provoke a state of terror in the general public, a group of persons or particular persons for political purposes are in any circumstance unjustifiable, whatever the considerations of a political, philosophical, ideological, racial, ethnic, religious or any other nature that may be invoked to justify them."

That's the UN's tentative working definition. No standardized international definition exists because of ideological differences.

Anyway, what happened at the fair may fit that working definition, being that the attacks were intended to cause terror for racial reasons.

Yet, as the post-er after you pointed out, there's danger in the broadening of terrorism. Much evil can come from it. Just look at the calls for the actual arrest of the CEO of Standard's & Poor's after they downgraded our national credit rating a smidge (when it should have been downgraded to junk status). Imagine what will be called terrorism if we take a broad view of the definition... Maybe criticizing the president would be called terrorism.
 
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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
I still find it completely amazing that, for the most part, our wonderful useless media IGNORED this!! Then, to top it off, most of the arrests were only for disorderly conduct?
 

skyraider

Veteran Expediter
US Navy
It all starts with the parents and how u train up a child , sounds lame doesn't it. But the days of manners and family order are a thing of the past and not taught to kids anymore. Yes sir and no sir and yes ma'am and no ma'am are not in vogue anymore, IMHO> To many divorces, to much confusion and u all know the rest. Oh, Sunday School and Church is out too, now thats really nerddy, isn't it?:eek:
 

cheri1122

Veteran Expediter
Driver
As awful as it was, the only credible witness [Chief of State Police] said "It did not appear to be racially motivated" [Love the witless who was stuck in traffic, and says "10 to 15 black males attacked a white male, just for being white" He could tell that, from his car, right?:rolleyes:]
Agree that it wasn't a good use of the label 'terrorist', which loses effectiveness if applied too broadly. [I know a LOT of people, kids & adults, who are terrified of clowns, too.]
Don't agree with Paullud's solution of vigilantes - as the witness in the car proved, ordinary folks are far too likely to see what they want to see, and rush to take the law into their own [unskilled] hands.
And Skyraider: I really don't think Sunday school [or lack thereof] has a lot to do with it, whatever "it" is. More questions than answers here, though.
One thing more: LOS is bothered by the lack of publicity, but I think it's a good thing, mostly. It should be reported, but when the media makes a major story of it, [like the shootings in Ohio], the excessive publicity may contribute to the repetition of such acts - some people would rather be notorious than neglected, methinks. Why encourage them? What good does it do? :confused:

 

AMonger

Veteran Expediter
As awful as it was, the only credible witness [Chief of State Police] said "It did not appear to be racially motivated" [Love the witless who was stuck in traffic, and says "10 to 15 black males attacked a white male, just for being white" He could tell that, from his car, right?:rolleyes:]


Well, now wait a minute. What makes the chief of the state police a credible witness? Was he there? If he wasn't, that eliminates him as a witness at all, credible or otherwise. Are you imparting credibility solely on his office? If so, that's very foolish. If he wasn't there, he has no better information than you or I--the reports of other people.

On the other hand, we have the report of someone who was definitely an eyewitness who related what he saw with his own eyes. If the chief wasn't there, that makes HIM witless and his testimony hearsay.

And the chief's testimony is suspect for another reason: political pressure to downplay the racial aspect of the situation.

When I was a guard, the city had an annual event called Septemberfest. This was the late 80s. Actually, the year this happened, I was one of the crowd control and first aid volunteers. Near the end of the night one night, a couple hundred black gangsters did much the same thing as what just happened in Wisconsin. They started down at one end of the midway and marched the whole length, fists in the air, yelling something I couldn't make out. Patrons scattered. The lone guard, unarmed and overwhelmed, was told to escort all the cashiers to safety. We had become acquainted over the preceding days, and since I had a gun and a uniform, he asked me to do it.

So the place was closed down early, but that's when the real fun started. There was an empty field just north of the site, and all these gang bangers ran wild in that area. Since we were being ushered out, I got in my pickup and left. Because of the one-way streets, I had to circle the block and go down the street on the north side of that empty field. As I did, I had bottles thrown at my truck and witnessed much the same as what happened in Wisconsin.

The next year was the last year Septemberfest was held downtown. They hadn't yet secured another site for it. But the police presence was about tripled, including plain clothes people to spot trouble before it started. A friend and I were hired for security. The year after that, they moved the event out west away from the gangs (the Crips and Bloods were active there).

But the point is this: even though the early reports were correct in saying that the troublemakers were black gang members in a racially-motivated incident, a day or two later, political pressure was applied, and the mayor and police chief, neither of whom were there, fell all over themselves downplaying the racial aspect and terming the gang members "unsupervised youths."

I can guarantee you the same exact thing is at work in Wisconsin.
 

tbubster

Seasoned Expediter
[

The trouble at the fair started around 7 p.m. Thursday in the midway area, where amusement rides are located, when fights broke out among black youths, said Tom Struebing, chief of the State Fair Police. Those fights did not appear to be racially motivated.



"We noticed a group of five to 10 young black males run up and jump a young white male for no other reason then him being white," Stikl said.

They knocked him to the ground, and then a group of 15 black men kicked and stomped on him, Stikl said.

"My wife's brother jumped out of the car - his natural reaction was to try to break it up. Before you knew it, five or 10 guys were on him and started punching at him. My wife was able to pull him back in the car. So now they surrounded my car and just started punching through the windows, kicking and shaking the car, screaming racial things."

State Fair melees produce 11 injuries, 31 arrests - JSOnline[/QUOTE]

As awful as it was, the only credible witness [Chief of State Police] said "It did not appear to be racially motivated" [Love the witless who was stuck in traffic, and says "10 to 15 black males attacked a white male, just for being white" He could tell that, from his car, right?:rolleyes:]
Agree that it wasn't a good use of the label 'terrorist', which loses effectiveness if applied too broadly. [I know a LOT of people, kids & adults, who are terrified of clowns, too.]
Don't agree with Paullud's solution of vigilantes - as the witness in the car proved, ordinary folks are far too likely to see what they want to see, and rush to take the law into their own [unskilled] hands.
And Skyraider: I really don't think Sunday school [or lack thereof] has a lot to do with it, whatever "it" is. More questions than answers here, though.
One thing more: LOS is bothered by the lack of publicity, but I think it's a good thing, mostly. It should be reported, but when the media makes a major story of it, [like the shootings in Ohio], the excessive publicity may contribute to the repetition of such acts - some people would rather be notorious than neglected, methinks. Why encourage them? What good does it do? :confused:


As you see the "the only credible witness" Cheif of state police WAS refering to the fight that broke out around 7pm between black youths.This was befor they went on a rampage attacking only white people.Also what makes him the "only Credible witness"?I guess all the people that were attacked and beaten..............Well im at a loss as to why you dont belive them to be credible.

"Love the witless who was stuck in traffic,an says 10 to 15 black males attacked a white male just for being white.He could tell that from his car right:rolleyes:"

Maybe because when his brother inlaw jumped out to help he then gets jumped his wife pulls him back into the van then the group of black men surround the van and start attacking by reaching through the windows throwing punches,kicking the car and shaking it all while yelling racial things.Now I could be wrong here but a group of black youths attack a car full of white people yelling racial slurs maybe just maybe that is where here felt the only reason the group of black youths attacked the white guy was for being white!:confused:

Also disagree with you on it should not be mad a big deal of in the media.I think that as it is kept under wraps then alot of people do not relize that this is happening and it is a problem.People do not like to admit that racism works both ways.It is eaiser for the media this way.I mean really if FOX news were to run a story on this jessie and al would be protesting them in the srteets calling them racist.

This is not just a problem in wisconsin either in the last three months there have been mob attacks like this in east st louis and alton IL.Other then a small write up in paper there was no coverage of it there either.With out proper news coverage there will be an attack and the white victims will fight back and some one gets hurt then the true victim gets charged with a hate crime.With out proper news coverage then the attackers will always be shown as the victim.With out proper news coverage the racism is not exposed.Its funny really the OP is right if it were white attacking black it would be all over the news and everyone would be upset about it rightfully so.What is sad is that people are not upset with this act of racism because the victims are white.

Cheri like you wrote in another thread about the GUY who has breast cancer and is being turned down for help because he is a man.Breast cancer is breast cancer does not matter if you are a man or women.Racism is racism no matter what color your skin is and it should be treated the same way everytime.Show it for the HATE that it is and punish those that act on it.
 

layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
As awful as it was, the only credible witness [Chief of State Police] said "It did not appear to be racially motivated" [Love the witless who was stuck in traffic, and says "10 to 15 black males attacked a white male, just for being white" He could tell that, from his car, right?:rolleyes:]
Agree that it wasn't a good use of the label 'terrorist', which loses effectiveness if applied too broadly. [I know a LOT of people, kids & adults, who are terrified of clowns, too.]
Don't agree with Paullud's solution of vigilantes - as the witness in the car proved, ordinary folks are far too likely to see what they want to see, and rush to take the law into their own [unskilled] hands.
And Skyraider: I really don't think Sunday school [or lack thereof] has a lot to do with it, whatever "it" is. More questions than answers here, though.
One thing more: LOS is bothered by the lack of publicity, but I think it's a good thing, mostly. It should be reported, but when the media makes a major story of it, [like the shootings in Ohio], the excessive publicity may contribute to the repetition of such acts - some people would rather be notorious than neglected, methinks. Why encourage them? What good does it do? :confused:



What bothers me is the extreme "double standard". As I said, had this mob been "skiinheads" attacking innocent black people there would be wall to wall reporting, calls for major investigations and the Tea Party and Palin would be blamed for "stirring" things up with "hate speech".

All reports, the ones I could find, make it clear that this WAS racially motivated and that the mob might have been as large as 100. Several innocent people we injured, ALL WHITE.

Now, it matters not that they were white, I would be just as outraged if the tables were turned. What does matter is that black racism and hatred of whites is either dismissed or down played. There is far too much racial "hate" in this country. Ignoring the ENTIRE problem or "excusing" part of it will never lead to a solution.
 

paullud

Veteran Expediter
Now, it matters not that they were white, I would be just as outraged if the tables were turned. What does matter is that black racism and hatred of whites is either dismissed or down played. There is far too much racial "hate" in this country. Ignoring the ENTIRE problem or "excusing" part of it will never lead to a solution.

When things like this are ignored it gives ammo to white supremacists to use for recruiting. I can hear it now, "The Jewish run media hates whites its us against them", this is just such a dumb thing to do and really shows that the media cares only about their agenda. I think a larger issue is there are lots of people that are prejudice and things like the actions of these blacks and the lack of reaction from the media angers them and pushes them towards being full blown racist.


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layoutshooter

Veteran Expediter
Retired Expediter
It is my belief that many in the so called "press" approve of these sorts of actions. Almost like these thugs are "freedom fighters" or some stupidity like that. Anyone who goes "against" the oppressor so to speak. Unless it is someone who joins the Tea Party. The left does not oppress. :eek: The ONLY thing worse is a BLACK member of the Tea Party.
 
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