Expedite Questions

[bbrs2000]

Hi Everyone! I am new in Expedite and I have few questions.
(Can't find answers anywere on this forum )
I am getting different answers from different people would like to get answer from someone from industry...

-DOT
I have Dodge Sprinter under 10,000 lbs and I have MC number I dont have DOT# because under 10,000lbs you are not rquired to have. But some people is telling me I should get DOT number because I am hauling comercial freight. Is this true?
Should I get DOT?

-Log Book
If I get DOT# , am I required to have Log Book?

-Hours of Service
I would like to know HOS are same for Semi Trucks and Sprinters or not?

Thank you

 

[BigBusBob]

HOS are HOS... Get a log book, fill it out the way a semi driver would. and you'll have no problems there- as long as your fuel receipts match your fuel times. And they can find out.

Generally vans do not need to run logs, but if you do- and you're pulled over and have one- you won't have to worry.

As far as DOT#'s, if you're hauling commercial freight- I would think you would need a DOT number. I've always run stuff with DOT #'s and MC #'s,
and always run at least one log book.

 

[Monty]

Logs are NOT required for vehicles under 10,000 ...... unless ... you are transporting hazmat requiring placards.

So, HOS would only apply to placarded loads, at that time, yes, the rules would be the same as semi drivers.

 

[Turtle]

Hi Everyone! I am new in Expedite and I have few questions.
(Can't find answers anywere on this forum )
I am getting different answers from different people would like to get answer from someone from industry...

Not to worry, there are plenty of people in the industry who will give you wrong answers, too.

-DOT
I have Dodge Sprinter under 10,000 lbs and I have MC number I dont have DOT# because under 10,000lbs you are not rquired to have. But some people is telling me I should get DOT number because I am hauling comercial freight. Is this true?
Should I get DOT?

Hauling "commercial freight" isn't the requirement. The first requirement for having to have a DOT# is driving a Commercial Motor Vehicle. A Sprinter under 10,000 pounds not placarded for HAZMAT is not a Commercial Motor Vehicle. If you ever haul material that required placarding, then you're a Commercial Motor Vehicle and will require a DOT#. Also, if you are a freight forwarder or a broker, which makes you a carrier, you will need a DOT#.

Go here (Registration & Assistance: USDOT Number/Operating Authority - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration), select the "Step-By-Step Registration Guide" in the Help Me Register section. If you answer NO to all of the questions, you don't need a DOT#.

-Log Book
If I get DOT# , am I required to have Log Book?

Only Commercial Motor Vehicles are required to have a log book. So in your case, unless you are placarded for HAZMAT, no, you don't need one.

-Hours of Service
I would like to know HOS are same for Semi Trucks and Sprinters or not?

No, they are not. HOS comes into play if your Sprinter is a Commercial Motor Vehicle, meaning placarded for HAZMAT, or the Sprinter is designed or used to transport more than 8 passengers (including the driver) for compensation, or is designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers, including the driver, not for compensation.

Thank you

You're welcome.

 

[Monty]

Turtle, a clarifaction ..... at anytime a Sprinter is required to log .... such as hazmt ... the HOS rules are exactly the same for all classes of vehicles.

Just in case the person asking the question might have been confused.

 

[Rocketman]

HOS are HOS... Get a log book, fill it out the way a semi driver would. and you'll have no problems there- as long as your fuel receipts match your fuel times. And they can find out.

Generally vans do not need to run logs, but if you do- and you're pulled over and have one- you won't have to worry.

As far as DOT#'s, if you're hauling commercial freight- I would think you would need a DOT number. I've always run stuff with DOT #'s and MC #'s,
and always run at least one log book.

So... I can't find a "dislike" button?

 

[Turtle]

Turtle, a clarifaction ..... at anytime a Sprinter is required to log .... such as hazmt ... the HOS rules are exactly the same for all classes of vehicles.

Just in case the person asking the question might have been confused.

Correct. At any time a Sprinter is required to log, it is because the Sprinter is a Commercial Motor Vehicle. And as such, is subject to all the rules and regulations which apply to Commercial Motor Vehicles, including accurate logging and all of the HOS rules.

 

[Brisco]

HOS are HOS... Get a log book, fill it out the way a semi driver would. and you'll have no problems there- as long as your fuel receipts match your fuel times. And they can find out.

Generally vans do not need to run logs, but if you do- and you're pulled over and have one- you won't have to worry.

With the way Cargo Vans are used in this industry, if a driver does fill out a Log Book like a "Semi" driver would, then YES, he will have problems and a whole lot to worry about if and when he ever presented it to a Trooper or any other DOT enforcer.

Just don't run any HazMat loads with a Sprinter and you'll never have to worry about logging. For now that is...................

 

[Turtle]

With the way Cargo Vans are used in this industry, if a driver does fill out a Log Book like a "Semi" driver would, then YES, he will have problems and a whole lot to worry about if and when he ever presented it to a Trooper or any other DOT enforcer.

Not if it's accurately filled out.

When you are not Commercial Motor Vehicle, you do not have to log. If you do log at the times you are not a Commercial Motor Vehicle, all times would accurately be logged as off-duty.

When you do pick up a HAZMAT load, the log book must reflect the previous 7 days. If you were not a Commercial Motor Vehicle at any time within those 7 days, and thus did not log, the logbook should still reflect off-duty for those 7 days.

Just don't run any HazMat loads with a Sprinter and you'll never have to worry about logging. For now that is...................

Yep. Any day now, any day. Tomorrow, probably. Mr. Camping predicts October, for sure.

 

[Moot]

When you do pick up a HAZMAT load, the log book must reflect the previous 7 days. If you were not a Commercial Motor Vehicle at any time within those 7 days, and thus did not log, the logbook should still reflect off-duty for those 7 days.

You just had to bring this up.

(insert smiley face here) Somehow the smiley face was added in front of the thread title. Oh well! The subject was debated to death several years ago. I will try to locate that thread or maybe just stick a dull #2 pencil in my left eye. Anyway, this is from the FMCSA Rules and Regulations part 395.2 Definitions.


On duty time means all time from the time a driver begins to work or is required to be in readiness to work until the time the driver is relieved from work and all responsibility for performing work. On duty time shall include:

(1) All time at a plant, terminal, facility, or other property of a motor carrier or shipper, or on any public property, waiting to be dispatched, unless the driver has been relieved from duty by the motor carrier;

(2) All time inspecting, servicing, or conditioning any commercial motor vehicle at any time;

(3) All driving time as defined in the term driving time;

(4) All time, other than driving time, in or upon any commercial motor vehicle except time spent resting in a sleeper berth;

(5) All time loading or unloading a commercial motor vehicle, supervising, or assisting in the loading or unloading, attending a commercial motor vehicle being loaded or unloaded, remaining in readiness to operate the commercial motor vehicle, or in giving or receiving receipts for shipments loaded or unloaded;

(6) All time repairing, obtaining assistance, or remaining in attendance upon a disabled commercial motor vehicle;

(7) All time spent providing a breath sample or urine specimen, including travel time to and from the collection site, in order to comply with the random, reasonable suspicion, post-accident, or follow-up testing required by part 382 of this subchapter when directed by a motor carrier;

(8) Performing any other work in the capacity, employ, or service of a motor carrier; and

(9) Performing any compensated work for a person who is not a motor carrier.

 

[Turtle]

What if you go OOS for a 3-month vacation in Aruba, and while you're down there you take on a part time job as an apprentice master baiter for a fishing boat? How much of that do you have to log?

 

[Moot]

If your name is Milt you had better log all time. If you should lose your sight from baiting then you will need a Braille logbook.

Isn't your load ready yet?

 

[Turtle]

Not yet. Should be in a few minutes.

Edit: Strike that. Dry run. Might have it ready by tomorrow. Awesome.

 

[Moot]

Too bad you can't collect detention and layover pay.

 

[Moot]

Attached is a copy of an Hours Of Service Certificate I used at an LTL company and an expedite company I was previously with. The LTL company used this for casual employees and city drivers who normally were not required to log, but on occasion would do a road run. The expedite company used it for van drivers who were not required to log unless hauling HAZMAT.

This certificate requires the driver to account for the total number of hours on duty for the preceding 7 days. It does not require the driver to differentiate between hours driving and hours on duty. Just total number of hours on duty.

If you are a van driver who occasionally hauls HAZMAT and must log, keep track of the total number of hours you are on duty each day, use this form and start a log on the day you pick up the HAZMAT load.

 

[Rocketman]

Attached is a copy of an Hours Of Service Certificate I used at an LTL company and an expedite company I was previously with. The LTL company used this for casual employees and city drivers who normally were not required to log, but on occasion would do a road run. The expedite company used it for van drivers who were not required to log unless hauling HAZMAT.

This certificate requires the driver to account for the total number of hours on duty for the preceding 7 days. It does not require the driver to differentiate between hours driving and hours on duty. Just total number of hours on duty.

If you are a van driver who occasionally hauls HAZMAT and must log, keep track of the total number of hours you are on duty each day, use this form and start a log on the day you pick up the HAZMAT load.

I like that form Moot. Thanks! I'll print that off when I start with the van. We don't haul any hazmat, but it's my understanding that at least one state requires vans to log? (is it Alabama?)

 

[Monty]

To the best of my knowledge, ALL states have adopted Federal guidelines ... the exception might be if you are doing INTRA state freight, in the state which you are based. Some of the "states only" rules are indeed different.

Vans, under 10,000k, engaged in interstate commerce do NOT log except when carrying hazmat, over 1,000 pounds, requiring a placard.

Landstar is one of the toughest carriers I know of. They require the log to BEGIN, at the moment you sign for the hazmat load, and to TERMINATE when you deliver it.

And that is only for placarded amount, (over 1,000 pounds), of most materials. And that log must be accurate, ya know, 11 hours driving, 10 hour breaks, etc

btw .. I'm NOT hauling anything in my van that requires placards in lesser amounts, such as phosgene gas etc ....

Some of out AA&E temas do haul explolsives in vans, but that is between them and God .... who I am not in a hurry to meet.

 

[Turtle]

Vans, under 10,000k, engaged in interstate commerce do NOT log except when carrying hazmat, over 1,000 pounds, requiring a placard.

If that were true, as written, then vans do not have to log even when they are carrying hazmat, under 1,000 pounds, requiring a placard.

Not trying to be pedantic, but leave out the "over 1,000 pounds" and it's a true statement, as in, "Vans, under 10,000k, engaged in interstate commerce do NOT log except when carrying hazmat requiring a placard." The reason for the inaccuracy is, if the freight requires a placard, it must be logged, regardless of the weight. It's just that vans don't often see Table 1 HAZMAT, which always requires placarding, in any amount. Most of the stuff (not all of it) from Table 1 cannot be hauled in a van, because most (not all) of the materials on Table 1 are restricted from being carried in the cab compartment, which includes the entire van, even one with a sealed bulkhead.

Of course, "hazmat requiring a placard" is bit redundant, since all HAZMAT requires a placard.

The wording really should be, "Vans, under 10,000k, engaged in interstate commerce do NOT log except when carrying material which requires a placard."

A small but important distinction.

 

[beachbum]

Of course, "hazmat requiring a placard" is bit redundant, since all HAZMAT requires a placard. .. Not true you can have hazmat in the van as long as they don't meet the weight requirements for placarding... It's still hazmat

 

[Turtle]

Of course, "hazmat requiring a placard" is bit redundant, since all HAZMAT requires a placard. .. Not true you can have hazmat in the van as long as they don't meet the weight requirements for placarding... It's still hazmat

This common misconception, while understandable, is still a misconception nonetheless. Clearly, there are a lot of people who have never bothered to read the actual definition of HAZMAT (or Hazardous Material). If it requires placarding then it's hazardous material, and if it doesn't require placarding then it's not hazardous material. It's as simple as that. You can make it more complicated if you want, but no matter how you try to complicate it, no matter how hard you want to try and reason with it or use common sense, the definition of hazardous material won't change.