Bush 'should face torture probe'

[EnglishLady]

BBC News

A campaign group has said the US president should order a criminal investigation into alleged torture sanctioned by the Bush administration.

Human Rights Watch (HRW) says there is "overwhelming evidence" of torture ordered by George W Bush.

The former president has defended some of the techniques, saying they prevented attacks and saved lives.

The Obama administration has launched inquiries into deaths in CIA custody and other "unauthorised actions".

But HRW argues these inquiries will not cover the activities which were specifically authorised as legal by officials within the Bush administration.

The former president, vice-president, defence secretary and head of the CIA should all be investigated, the group says.

"There are solid grounds to investigate [George] Bush, [former vice-president Dick] Cheney, [former defence secretary Donald] Rumsfeld, and [former CIA director George] Tenet for authorising torture and war crimes," said Kenneth Roth, Human Rights Watch's executive director.

"President Obama has treated torture as an unfortunate policy choice rather than a crime.

"His decision to end abusive interrogation practices will remain easily reversible unless the legal prohibition against torture is clearly re-established."

In its 107-page report, HRW claims there is substantial information warranting criminal investigations of Mr Bush and his senior officials for ordering practises such as waterboarding, the use of secret CIA prisons and the transfer of detainees to countries where they were tortured.

Mr Bush has said he followed the advice of his legal advisers, who told him, for example, that the use of waterboarding on several Guantanamo inmates was legal.

The failure to investigate officials undermines US efforts to press for accountability for human rights violations abroad in countries like Libya and Sri Lanka, the group argues

 

[greg334]

Human Rights Watch should be changing their name to US rights watch. They have not fought against the human trafficking in Mexico, Africa and the EU and have criticized us for our immigration policies.

 

[LDB]

Perhaps if there had been any torture of any type there should be. Since there was no torture it's a moot point. As mentioned, HRW is nothing but hypocritical hand wringers.

 

[scottm4211]

Perhaps if there had been any torture of any type there should be. Since there was no torture it's a moot point. As mentioned, HRW is nothing but hypocritical hand wringers.

Leo ixnay on "moot"

 

[Freightdawg]

Water boarding vs. chopping off heads? I think one can recover more quickly after being waterboarded than after losing one's head!

 

[LisaLouHoo]

Yeah...I gotta feeling one would not get the desired result by giving a terrorist a Red Slurpee and a bag of Fritos. I suspect they are different from, say, me.

We could be a whole lot meaner, for certain.

Is it just me, or did all those treaties and international caucuses set up after WWII in order to prevent another Hitler-type regime and crimes against humanity, do nothing more than tie the hands of victimized countries? Seems like anyone who is attacked without provocation is supposed to turn the other cheek, smile and send a fruit basket to the attacker as per some paragraph in a late 40's treaty.

"Bruises fade and bones will mend-but a psyche can be ruined FOREVER" : LisaLouHoo, c. 2008

 

[EnglishLady]

Yeah...I gotta feeling one would not get the desired result by giving a terrorist a Red Slurpee and a bag of Fritos. I suspect they are different from, say, me.

We could be a whole lot meaner, for certain.

Is it just me, or did all those treaties and international caucuses set up after WWII in order to prevent another Hitler-type regime and crimes against humanity, do nothing more than tie the hands of victimized countries? Seems like anyone who is attacked without provocation is supposed to turn the other cheek, smile and send a fruit basket to the attacker as per some paragraph in a late 40's treaty."Bruises fade and bones will mend-but a psyche can be ruined FOREVER" : LisaLouHoo, c. 2008

Do you mean the Geneva Convention?

The Geneva Conventions of 1949 and their Additional Protocols

 

[Turtle]

Water boarding vs. chopping off heads? I think one can recover more quickly after being waterboarded than after losing one's head!

True enough, but beheading someone isn't normally a torture technique, since it's rare to obtain any kind of valuable information from someone once you have separated their head from their body. Beheading is generally reserved for the end of torture when you've gotten everything you're going to get out of someone, and you want to give whoever is next in line for torture an incentive. That's the only real value of torture, anyway, that of intimidation. Torture is the clumsiest and least effective method of gathering intelligence. It so rarely yields any kind of valid, actionable intelligence that you have to wonder why it's ever used at all, other than the fact that people can be just mean at times and that this kind of stuff just makes people feel better, even if it doesn't work.

In any case, do not forget that many prisoners were secreted off to black locations (like in Egypt, for example) where they were tortured brutally by means far worse than waterboarding. Many died in custody during torture, including some who were taken as as a result of mistaken identity and were continued to be tortured even after we knew they were the wrong person.

 

[scottm4211]

We need to step up the program. Stun guns are being found on planes.