Am I the only one who thinks this is bull crap

TS462 · Feb 20, 2009

A friend of mine. Told me that he was going to work for a new owner. but here is the catch if he runs less than 3000 miles as a team the owner starts knocking off a like 5%. because he said due to the tough times he needs that extra cash to run the business. But during the good times if they ever come back would he give that extra 5%. i just think as an owner thats pretty bush leauge to me

DougTravels · Feb 20, 2009

Sounds like the owner is trying to cover his as s at your expense.
I could understand it if you were out of service, but if you are available and don't get 3k, what can you do about it.

Doggie Daddy · Feb 20, 2009

The title of your post,"Am I the only one who thinks this is bull crap",seems to be saying that your friend DOESN'T think it is bull crap.

davekc · Feb 20, 2009

Too hard to say without much more information. What type of vehicle, too much time off, over financed truck, truck with no generator, excessive deadhead, running for a budget carrier, lack of freight, and the list goes on.
The fleet owner may need it for a variety of those reasons including greed.
But the reality is many banked on a certain level of income years ago running for some of these budget carriers and their well is drying up. They are reliant on the larger carriers for overflow and they aren't getting it. Or they try to compete on loads from the price point, but then fail to have the coverage or insurance to run them. They will find loads, but the deadhead will be longer, the rates lower, and extended wait times between loads.
The thing about most companies is the driver knows the loads and the price. Find out what the ACTUAL cost is to run the truck (fleet owners) expenses, and you will be much closer to your answer.
With my teams there is no "secret" as to what revenue I generate from their truck. They have all the information right in front of them.

EASYTRADER · Feb 21, 2009

I have a D unit with FECC and we almost never get3000 miles a week. Even when it was busy 3000 miles would be a lot.

last month we had 4500 hundred
miles total. I guess either the favoritism or economy is catching up with us.

nightcreacher · Feb 21, 2009

EASYTRADER said:
I have a D unit with FECC and we almost never get3000 miles a week. Even when it was busy 3000 miles would be a lot.

last month we had 4500 hundred
miles total. I guess either the favoritism or economy is catching up with us.

If I ever ran an average of 3000 miles a week,here at FDCC,I couldnt spend all the money I would make.My usual year is 120000 miles,that gets me over $200000.I did 140000 miles once,made over 1/4 million dollars.Why wear your truck out on a mileage contract?
It's work smarter not harder

cannedmeat27 · Feb 21, 2009

night im just curious but how could you afford
to run 1.4 million miles in a year for only a little
over 200000 dollars lol

nightcreacher · Feb 21, 2009

cannedmeat27 said:
night im just curious but how could you afford
to run 1.4 million miles in a year for only a little
over 200000 dollars lol

lol fat fingers 1 to many 0's,besides how are there enough days in a year to run 1000000 miles fixed type o

moose · Feb 21, 2009

nightcreacher said:
If I ever ran an average of 3000 miles a week,here at FDCC,I couldnt spend all the money I would make.My usual year is 120000 miles,that gets me over $200000.I did 140000 miles once,made over 1/4 million dollars.Why wear your truck out on a mileage contract?
It's work smarter not harder

Is that gross pay to the truck ?
what do you mean by "made" ?
how many of them Millage as a team ?
how many as a WG ?
nothing come free .

Moose.

Tempest · Feb 21, 2009

Sorry Dave, I rarely disagree with you but I cant for the life of me come up with a way to justify punishing a driver for not reaching a set amount of miles unless those miles were offered and refused. If this owner doesnt think he can pay the percentage he shouldnt offer it. I know a few who say "I will pay you "X" percent but if you reach "X" number of miles I will add a bonus of 5%" but to say I will take 5%?? I am afraid I would be tossing him the keys and suggesting a new place he might wanna park his truck!!

davekc · Feb 21, 2009

I don't know all of the particulars in the original post, but hypothetically speaking, should a owner take a beating because a driver takes excessive time off? And for how long prior to just terminating the contract? Kinda of a gray area.
In that instance, the driver is causing the financial strain. We read post after post about how a driver's personal agenda starts to cause havoc on the revenue. I address that in our contract but many don't.

pjjjjj · Feb 21, 2009

davekc said:
I don't know all of the particulars in the original post, but hypothetically speaking, should a owner take a beating because a driver takes excessive time off? And for how long prior to just terminating the contract? Kinda of a gray area.
In that instance, the driver is causing the financial strain. We read post after post about how a driver's personal agenda starts to cause havoc on the revenue. I address that in our contract but many don't.

We've also read post after post about how many expediters are not getting enough miles lately. In that instance, it's the economy causing the financial strain, via the carrier offering less loads. Hypothetically speaking, should the driver take *more* of a beating because of that?
And what happens when the team actually does the 3000 miles in the week, however the rates are so reduced and the deadhead so high that neither the owner nor the driver can win?
Who takes the hit then?
I agree it's all got to be laid out in the contract, and hopefully people think about these possibilities so all bases are covered when situations arise.

davekc · Feb 21, 2009

In the short answer, no. The only time something like that should effect the driver is if they are doing something to have a negative effect on the revenue. You can't penalize the driver because the carrier isn't producing freight.
If a drivers availability is weak, then that might be a alternative.
Again, it is hard to tell with this post because the particulars aren't mentioned.

pjjjjj · Feb 21, 2009

Tempest said:
.......If this owner doesnt think he can pay the percentage he shouldnt offer it. I know a few who say "I will pay you "X" percent but if you reach "X" number of miles I will add a bonus of 5%" but to say I will take 5%?? I am afraid I would be tossing him the keys and suggesting a new place he might wanna park his truck!!

After looking at the OP again, that is actually what he IS saying.. this friend is going to work for a new owner, and the owner is specifying, up front, what the deal is. In effect, the drivers are getting a 5% bonus, if they run over 3000 miles in a given week. It's being worded that if they run under 3000 miles, they'll 'lose' 5%. Cup half full or half empty, just a matter of wording. The owner knows how much he needs to continue operating. So should the drivers. They can take it or leave it. It's not like the owner is changing the details arbitrarily midway through the contract.

nightcreacher · Feb 21, 2009

Moose,2006,ran 140000 miles,249000 dollars,wasnt in w/g,all team miles

Tempest · Feb 22, 2009

TS462 said:
but here is the catch if he runs less than 3000 miles as a team the owner starts knocking off a like 5%. ........... But during the good times if they ever come back would he give that extra 5%.

Taken just like this I have to agree pjjjjj. Prhaps it is just in the wording. I read it first as "if you dont run 3000 miles you lose 5%" having re-read it one could take it as "5% bonus for running over 3000 miles. I guess I have just seen too many screwed lately and jump to quick

Yesteryear · Feb 24, 2009

If I am reading this correctly I totally agree this is "bullcrap"! 3000 miles is hard to come by right now and I think we all know this. My husband and I have not been home since Dec 29th. We stay out for months at a time and seldom turn down legit load offers. We will turn down some loads that are crap, for instance a 10 mile load with a 48 mile d.h. to pick-up, or a 200 mile load to a poor location when we are 1st out in a hot spot. I consider this to be judgement calls. Right now on an average we are getting 1500 to 2000 miles per week. We have had 1 week in months were we actually hit 3000 miles. Is this our fault? We take what is offered. Should we be 'penalized' because the freight is not there? I say absolutely not!

Unless this is a 5% bonus being offered to the driver if the truck gets 3000 miles a week and not the drivers 'precentage' the driver would do good to find another truck owner to drive for. If the truck owners want to require the truck get a minimum of 3000 miles per week they need to get their butts out here in these trucks and see how well they do.

Another point to raise to some of you 'truck owners' remember when you are making requirements, for instance requiring the driver to take a load, telling the driver how long to stay out or how long they can stay home, or even what loads they can and cannot take you are changing the driver from an independant contractor to an employee. Remember this when you get challenged at the end of the year when you try to give the driver a 1099. After-all, instead of the driver paying that occ insurance, you could be paying it, you also could be paying some of the social security. So truck owners what do you want, drivers as independent contractors or employees? Seems to me some of you truck owners want it both ways.

Jefferson3000 · Feb 24, 2009

davekc said:
Too hard to say without much more information. What type of vehicle, too much time off, over financed truck, truck with no generator, excessive deadhead, running for a budget carrier, lack of freight, and the list goes on.
The fleet owner may need it for a variety of those reasons including greed.
But the reality is many banked on a certain level of income years ago running for some of these budget carriers and their well is drying up. They are reliant on the larger carriers for overflow and they aren't getting it. Or they try to compete on loads from the price point, but then fail to have the coverage or insurance to run them. They will find loads, but the deadhead will be longer, the rates lower, and extended wait times between loads.
The thing about most companies is the driver knows the loads and the price. Find out what the ACTUAL cost is to run the truck (fleet owners) expenses, and you will be much closer to your answer.
With my teams there is no "secret" as to what revenue I generate from their truck. They have all the information right in front of them.

That's exactly why, as a small 1 truck carrier, I took myself out of much of that "expedite overflow" loop. So many of those industries and customers have been so canabalized that there is nothing left. Yeah, I still partner with some of them, but I've found a green field for myself at home.